Awesome. And this time, Dodge will be in the show to prove that it can do with 6 cylinders what the others can't do with 8...because it's a TRUE diesel engine and not some hot-rodded V8 sales tactic. The Dodge camp is sitting back laughing at GM and Ford, because those two camps keep coming out with the hottest and latest stuff to stay ahead in the HP and torque wars...and all Dodge has to do is turn the Cummins up a little more. LOL. They have to be cracking up when they do this. "So Ford has 800 lb/ft finally? Ok, turn the Cummins up a tad more. " LMAO. Ford had a shot at Cummins back in 1984 and turned it down. Bet they are still kicking themselves over that.

That trailer is overkill for just 18,500# combined trailer and load. The load should be 18,000#, since it will probably have little aero drag. Try a 18,000 5th wheel toy hauler!

Hmmm. Trailer shootout opportunity?

no ford or chev can out pull RAM

So for those pulling really heavy loads are you pulling flatbed equipment trailers with cargo on them or are most of the heavy haulers actually putting giant 5th wheels? Toy Haulers, Pure RV, or 40 foot goose neck race trailers. I see alot more Large box style loads then open deck low aero profile heavy loads. I wonder how these trucks would handle a 30 mph cross wind with a tall 5th wheel. Or how much semi passing by at 80 mph impacts stability.

As Oxi once said, I am sure Ford is rather upset. They beat the crap out of GM and Dodge, forced them both to fail only to have the federal government bail them out to live another day!

There is no acceptance for a communist/socialist system here in this great nation. GM should have failed! Somebody else would have came along to pick up the pieces like BETTER MANAGEMENT and started over!

If the federal government can bail out GM and Chrysler, then they should bail out ALL businesses that fail. That can of worms is open now and the federal government should pay for unfairly allowing a company to survive like this.

Has capatalism been replaced by communist and socialist ideals in this nation?

GM and Ram failed and the free market should determine their fate, NOT THE WELFARE CHECK!

Bring the next Heavy Duty Comparison, but I know who the real winner already is, the one who sells the most and did not file bankruptcy and take a bailout.

Actually Toni, Alan Mulally went to Washington to try to help get money for GM and Chrysler because they share some of the same suppliers which depended on the survival of GM and Chrysler.

That all sounds well and good for Ford until you find that Ford got $15.9 billion in TARP funds. So much for Ford doing it on their own.

@Mitch- trailer isn't overkill at all- with #10k axles and #3-4k hitch weight, #18.5k just leaves a little margin for SAFETY. Besides, that is how much weight the trucks will handle, according to the manufacturers. An experiment in stupid human overload is a different matter entirely.
@WXman- don't kid yourself. If anything, the Ram is limited by its LNT aftertreatment, which will only tolerate so much power, before it would fail emissions. While that may be of no concern to you, the EPA takes that sort of thing very serious.

@sleder, Where the heck have you been, GM and Ford have prooved to outpull Ram all day long.

I think that the test should be done with a toy box trailer or monster camper trailer. The crappy aerodynamics can be like adding a few extra tons of weight, much more with head winds.
With that being said, at least the loads and trailers will be the same. A level playing field. It will be interesting to see how big a difference there is between the Rumble in the Rockies and this test.
I expect the various loyalists are practicing their gloating and or excuse routines right now ;) LOL
I'd like to see the underdog Ram win.
Guts.Glory.Ram.
What a lame ad slogan. Barfff

@
Toni
You know it gets old hearing the BS about GM getting government aid, when Ford got lucky.What happened was Ford was in finacial trouble first in early 2008. They went to the banks and started to get loans from all banks that would lend them money. They had loan contracts with the banks and when the crash happened the banks tried to default on there loans. While GM and Chrysler tried to get loans at that time when there was no money. Ford threatened to sue the banks over the defaulting of loans and subsaquently got there money. While GM had more money in there savings at the time of the crash than Ford. But with the money from the banks Ford was able to make through the crash and the turnaround of economy While GM set there bleeding out all of there savings.

SO FORD GOT VERY LUCKY OR THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN THE FIRST IN LINE FOR CASH!!!

Ford didn't take TARP money. The other two did.

The TARP money (taxpayer funded) was what GM and Chrysler (Ram) took and we'll end up losing money on that "bailout".

What Ford, BMW and Toyota was a loan guarantee and the gov’t was the only lender in town. They were forced to take these guarantees because no private sector bank was going to meet the rules imposed on them by the GOVERNMENT at the time.

The loans to Ford, BMW and Toyota were all short term and have been fully repaid. We made money.

The TARP loans to GM, GMAC and Chrysler have not and never will be fully repaid. The bond holders in GM and Chrysler got screwed and the unions will end up keeping our tax dollars.

That didn't happen with Toyota and Ford.

Toni, Ford took $15.9B in TARP funds.

http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2010/12/report-ford-took-federal-funds-too.html

@snowman cummins is a better engine. powerstrokes just keep blowing heads and going to the repair shop. duramaxs have bad injectors. ram just pulls all day long. with no diesel exhuast fuild. ram is also the only one with a manual trans. RAM is the best.

I was not a fan of the bailout either, they should have gone through the regular bankruptcy process, and then if a bailout was the only option, then go for it. But the money was handed out from Obama. It's done, it's paid back now with interest, so it ended up being a good investment. Let's leave that alone and vote someone else who can exercise more control on spending. Build up the economy so the private sector can run the economy like it should. Let banks handle the loans. GM makes great trucks, just like Ford and Chrysler do. Mentioning bailouts on every news story is getting ridiculous.

I'm sorry I had to bring this up but when someone says Ram is lauhging at the competition, all I can say is I refuse to support laughingstock failures and crybabies like GM and Chrysler! Ram doesn't even make a Heavy Duty truck in the United States anymore. Rams are all Mexican made. So keeping on laughing. You know nothing!

My prediction:
1) GM
2) Ford
3) Ram

@ toni
My truck is made in Flint MI. and my engine in Moraine OH.
Where is that underachieving Power Stroke made.

DM, That wasn't tarp. That was a loan to Ford and Toyota credit since banks were not lending at time - this is the same thing the gov does to every bank, and that has already been repaid. Learn how to read.

If the next Heavy Duty comparison going to be different, I am going to go out on a limb here and say that Ford could pull an upset here.

Ram will come in third. No doubt.

1) Ford
2) GM
3) Ram

Toyota will not be in it but they will still be the most American made.

Who made this quote.

"Awesome. And this time, Dodge will be in the show to prove that it can do with 6 cylinders what the others can't do with 8...because it's a TRUE diesel engine and not some hot-rodded V8 sales tactic. The Dodge camp is sitting back laughing at GM and Ford, because those two camps keep coming out with the hottest and latest stuff to stay ahead in the HP and torque wars...and all Dodge has to do is turn the Cummins up a little more. LOL. They have to be cracking up when they do this. "So Ford has 800 lb/ft finally? Ok, turn the Cummins up a tad more. " LMAO. Ford had a shot at Cummins back in 1984 and turned it down. Bet they are still kicking themselves over that"

So GM and Ford make hot rodded V8 sales tactics for engines? Excuse me. And this guy is an absolute idiot for assuming that Dodge is going to own this shootout. As was proved in the last shootout, just because your truck has 800 foot pounds of torque doesn't mean it will beat a truck with 765 foot pounds of torque.

I predict Dodge will finish last in this contest with ford second and the Mighty Duramax and Allison transmission finishing 1st. So let it be written, so let it be done!

@Michigan Bob, I think your predictions are correct. That's not to say the Dodge is a bad truck though, because I still really like it.

@ BOB
Spot on "real world towing" I wonder if they going up in elevation, we all know how that out come will be.

madmax,
Ford Super Duty is made in Louisville, Kentucky and as you know, the engine in Mexico. Silverado and F-series are equally 61% and 60% American. What is fascinating to me is GM is taxpayer bailout funded and shutting down their US truck plants, but keeping the Mexican plant running.

The Toyota Tundra and Tacoma is made in Texas. The Tundra is the only truck to make the top 10 list of most American made being at least 75% American.

Revised prediction:
1) Ford
2) GM
3) Ram

Bring on the next Heavy Duty Comparison.

@Bob
'So GM and Ford make hot rodded V8 sales tactics for engines? Excuse me. As was proved in the last shootout, just because your truck has 800 foot pounds of torque doesn't mean it will beat a truck with 765 foot pounds of torque.'

Well said, Bob. Ram was a distant 3rd in the heavy duty shootout comparison. Only an Dodge fanboy would think after a few sprinkles of magic spring dust, Dodge is going to win it all this time, let alone run away with it.

I still stand by Ram coming in 3rd. It will take more than a few sprinkles of magic spring dust to be a champion. It is going to be exciting.

Those of you talking smack about a ram must have never pulled with one bottom line. When you're grossing 30K your not gonna be driving like your racing. The real test is how the engines react to the load over the long haul...which engine can handel the load better and keep the load moving better. I like Rams and even if it does finished 3rd its not going to change my opinion about them. I own 4 and tow with them all. Would trade it for anything. Good luck to them all!

@ toni
I could care less where the tundra is made I'll never and I mean never own a Toyota, even when my family works at the corperate office. I could get very good pricing on any Toyota but won't buy.

Guys,

George W bailed out GM and Chrysler.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122969367595121563.html

this is the article from the Wall Street Journal (Rupert Murdoch=Fox) so no argument about some "liberal media". These are the TARP funds that were partially wiped out with the bankruptcy (converted to preferred stock ownership).

Here is the Forbes article which might be a little more balanced reporting

http://www.forbes.com/2008/12/20/auto-bailout-update-markets-equity-cx_cg_1219markets29.html

Obama allowed both GM and Chrysler to enter a structured bankruptcy that let them come out with significantly reduced debts and future obligations but still let the process go through BK.

http://www.usnews.com/news/obama/articles/2009/03/30/obama-gm-chrysler-must-restructure-or-face-bankruptcy

If you want to start the blame game again for who did what and which party is evil/commy/socialist/anti-capitalism/etc at least know where to direct your hate.

Rant over.

On another note I am really pleased to see this updated shootout with the big guns from each manufacturer. I hope the Ram is much more competitive. Mike, is the new HO Cummins backed up with the new 6 speeds?

1. Gm
2. Ram
3. Ford

Here is another person claiming Ram is the best. Well, we will see about that won't we. I trust pickuptrucks.com will make sure the test is run fair and square.

@snowman cummins is a better engine. powerstrokes just keep blowing heads and going to the repair shop. duramaxs have bad injectors. ram just pulls all day long. with no diesel exhuast fuild. ram is also the only one with a manual trans. RAM is the best.

Again, I predict the Duramax and Allison transmission to come out on top. There isn't a better diesel and transmission combination in the business. I predict GM'S duramax to win and ford second and Dodge's new high output cummins to finish 3rd. That is only my prediction and you may have a different one.

If GM and Ford had so many problems with their diesels as this idiot claims, than why do people still buy them in droves?
Now, what manufacture makes the "Motor Trend Truck of The Year? Is it Ford? Nope, is it Dodge, Nope, Nope. Ah, it must be Chevrolet Silverado HD! Yep, Yep, Yep, Yep...

Hey Mike, does that mean you're going up and through the Eisenhower tunnel and over Vail Pass? Hmmm, didn't the Ford get blown away buy the Chevy last time... Curious to see how to RAM goes up and down that grade.
I'm not favorable to any brand, right now I have a very reliable (220K on the ODO meter) Silverado but I would buy any brand be it Ford, Chevy or Ram.

@Bert: We're hitting Eisenhower and Davis Dam. How's that for high and low altitude testing? The +100-F temps in Arizona are going to be brutal on these trucks.

I wouldn't use the Rumble in the Rockies as a benchmark for who will win the test. They used less aerodynamic camper and horse trailers.
The last HD shootout was close between the Ford and GMC trucks. Will a job 2 Ford do better? Ford was hampered somewhat by wheel hop and traction control interventions. Has Ford tweeked that system?
What gear ratios will these trucks come with. Some say that the Ford actually would of done better with taller gears.
No one knows how the new Ram HO's will do. The old Cummins was obviously underpowered compared to the other 2. (please note - underpowered in comparison as opposed to not being able to do a job well)
I'm not about to make any predictions.
The D-Max truck based on the results of previous tests is the "odds on" favorite.
Will Ford be 2nd?
Looks like most guys have relegated the Cummins Ram to # 3.
It will be an entertaining read.
How many guys will read the test starting on the last page?
I know that I'll look there first.

@ TONI AND BOB You guys are to much. Toni you seem suprised and/or offended that Ram HDs are built in Mexico. GET OVER IT THIS IS NOT NEW INFO. I own a 93 3/4 ton Ram that was made in Mexico. Toni must be female if she can hold a grudge for that long. And for you Bob, the best engine combo out there is the Cummins mated to the G56 manual tranny. I don't care who builds the auto tranny, it will never outlast a manual tranny thats driven properly and it will never offer the control either. If the duramax and PS are so great why arnt they used in the real HD trucks driving all over the country. Buy what you like and enjoy it, isn't that what you say all the time? Several things I can guarntee about the shootout, it will be unbiased, it will prove who's fastest/more efficient/etc, and it won't change anyones opinion about who makes the best truck. Now why don't you shut the puck up.

looking forward to the shootout. As for the Cummins, it will never win the drag races against the Duramax. The I-6 design is more suited for low-rpm tugging. Unless Cummins switches to a V8, it's going to be the engine to get the load moving easily, but it's never going to rev hard and get up the mountain quickly or be the engine for quick overtaking. It's not a bad thing, it's just about preference.

Toni it was TARP funds given to Ford, says so right in the article that was referenced. And you question my ability to read. Your laughable.

Has to be a lot easier to get 3 utility trailers versus three 5th wheel trailers. No doubt wind resistance would make a huge difference.

I'm guessing Cummins' new engine will have substance and I'll give it 2nd place. Unless Ford resolved their issues, they'll take last.

1) GM
2) Ram
3) Ford

Personally I'm more interested in fuel economy than races to mountain tops. These comparos are good entertainment but are as valuable as teats on a Ram pickup these days.

My prediction is that a GM truck will not win. Let it be written and let it be done. Let the crying begin!!

DM, Just because a blogger says it, doesn't make it so. Ford was not a TARP participant. Ford, BMW, Toyota, Harley got a loan gaurantee (not tax payer funds) when the banks weren't lending and the loan has since been repaid. TARP money is where the Governemnt buys assets and stock to bailout a company with tax payer money. Ford did not go that. GM and Chrysler did. You can read who the participants were here, only GM and Chrysler on that list:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troubled_Asset_Relief_Program#Participants

No back to the next Heavy Duty Comparsion.

Frank, I think you might be right. Both low and high altitude this time.

@ alex

As much as it pains me to sort of agree with you that the Cummins will have a tough time pulling a drag race off against a V8, i do hafta say you may be right there. The I6 design is meant to get it moving and keep it moving. The Cummins redline is 3000, the duramax and PS i think are around the 4-5 mark, also with a 4 journal crank vs a 6 journal crank, thats substantially more iron that swings about, so it takes longer for 1 revolution to complete itself. So that right there should point to an advantage when it comes to speed, but going back to the keeping it moving part, I6's do not lug anywhere near as bad as V8's do, which is why they're used in OTR trucks, tractors, construction equipment, fire trucks, etc.

My prediction

1.Ram(just cuz i like Ram)
2.GM
3.Ford

The only thing I'll predict is all the gloating, bragging, bitching and moaning after the test.
I hope that GM looses for one reason only - I don't want to listen to Bob gloat for a year.

@Michigan Bob
do powerstroke or duramax have a million mile club like ram?????????

and its MY oppion ram is the best. just because i dont like the same truck as you i'm a idiot?

and i know two guys. one just spent a huge amount of money on fixing the blown heads for his powerstroke. a 6.4L powerstroke which he doesnt plow or tow with. the other plows and tows with his 2001 dodge cummins . he has never had a problem with it. clearly cummins is a better engine.

1. GM
2. Who
3. Cares

I can't wait...

If you site Wikipedia as a legitimate factual reference you're not very intelligent.lol

GM will win, which will be nothing new. Up hill test which is arguable who cares, GM will run away with that one, the RAM just doesn't have the HP to keep up, but I will watch to see if the Ford can keep it's tranny enguaged.lol. Down hill test will be interesting to see which truck holds back best, the Ford is out of that competition, obviously, but I will be interested in the GM vs RAM exhaust brakes, i bet it will be very close; overall feel and stability will go to the GM since it's been freshly redesigned from the ground up to specifically handle this much weight. Fuel economy is a toss up with the Ford having a slight edge, half an MPG if I remember from earlier tests, RAM will lose that one hard with the outdated Cummins and its exhaust system.

@greg acorrding to this, ram has a better exhuast brake. http://www.dieselpowermag.com/features/1107dp_2011_diesel_truck_of_the_year/ford_f250_super_duty.html

Please use the exact same amount of ballast for each tow vehicle. When I am looking for a new vehicle for towing my fifthwheel, my fifthwheel does not change weight depending on which truck I purchase. I need to know how the trucks compare when towing exactly the same weight. Thanks.

The Cummins is not outdated. It is not as fast up the hill or in 1/4 mile drags but it will still be running when the others are gone. And it will climb those hills at 2100 rpm or less, not at 3800 rpm like my previous V8 diesel did. The Ford and the GM will work very hard on those hills. The Ram will hardly breathe hard at all. This is based on my experience of several years of fulltime rv'ing towing a 16k pound fifthwheel. These tests unfortunately do not measure longevity.

that link also says RAM has the best durabillity