2012 NAIAS: Up Close With an Old Favorite

Realtree lead

No pickup truck debuts this year (not much even for SUVs) but a lot of car news at the 2012 NAIAS. But we did see an old friend stuffed in the corner of the Chevy booth. We first saw the Chevy Silverado HD RealTree Outfitters at the 2011 SEMA show in Las Vegas, but it's nice to see that it's here, especially among so many ordinary-looking stock trucks in the Chevy floor display. Shiney and clean is good but we miss some of the big trucks from last year. 

The Realtree Outfitters truck is a moderately lifted HD platform running a Duramax turbo-diesel and could be a nice companion to last year's GMC All-Terrain concept. Unfortunately, the All-Terrain GMC wasn't here this morning. Big tires, fully carpeted bed, plenty of storage for hunting gear, and a ton of interior camo accents are the truck's key highlights. All we can think is we need to drive this truck. 

Realtree int

Realtree bed

Realtree wheel

Realtree 1

Comments

Not a fan of the huge bowtie graphic on the side, but a sharp looking truck otherwise!

Finally something decent for a change. Nice job Realtree on a sharp looking truck. The Craptor could take some cosmetic lessons from this truck. GM WINS AGAIN!! whahahaha

Realtree? Where? Nice truck except for the lame bowtie graphics, topper, and carpet in the bed.

Bobby McMichigan realy you needed another name variation bob this is getting really old really fast.

Yep, it is a beatiful Chevy Truck and it can kick the tar out of the ford craptor too. Yep, I said the ford craptor. Wait for it, here comes the crying from ford girly men.

Just another cheap ugly rip off.

Dear Chevy, Try coming up with something original. Ram just came out with a 2012 Ram that had camo a couple months ago.

It is beautiful. This is one concept I really like. I just wish Chevy would either go back to a SFA or somehow shave about 5 inches off the bottom of that frame where the torsion bars tie in. I just don't like their low hanging frames. Real Tree did a nice job hiding it though with the black ground effects.

Oh man, I was hoping the new Silverado would be debuting here.

I like the tire and rim combo

GET THIS THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS. GM IS NOT GOING BACK TO SFA JUST BECAUSE YOU WANT THEM TO. GM'S TRUCKS HAVE THE SUPERIOR RIDE OVER FORD AND DODGE'S HD'S AND THE INDEPENDENT FRONT SUSPENSION IS PERFECTLY FINE FOR IT'S APPLICATION. If you don't like it I have the perfect solution for you, buy something else. Just stop complaining about it.

@Michigan Bob
I'll keep reposting this everytime you say something stupid.
Let it be written over and over and over............

On the topic of 4x4 versus 4x2. 4x4 is a luxury. Unless you go into some really really tough places, do you really need it?
I had a Chevy Safari 4x2 for 2 winters. Yeah, sure, my 4x4 is much nicer to get around in, but for 99% of the populace - NO, 4x4 is not necessary. I grew up in Northen Canada. My dad worked in logging and construction. He never owned a 4x4. He pulled a 29 ft camper trailer and a 500 gallon fuel tank into some of the most remote places in the country. He got stuck sometimes, but a 4x4 would of got stuck too.
I use 4x4 only when I absolutely need it, and that isn't very often.
Last time I checked - Trophy trucks are 4x2 and they don't seem to have a problem.

Now - Bob's remaining rants. Let me cut and paste.

IIRC - you own a 1993 Chevy Silverado with a 5.7.
You don't even own a diesel truck. Your company vehicle is a car - an Impala.
Keep bragging.

1. GMC has won shoutouts with the Duramax/Allison combo.
2. Anyone who read the HD shootout knows that GM finished 3rd in the gasser portion on the shootout.
3. GM won the Rumble in the Rockies with the Duramaxx/Allison combo.
4. You brag about the 5.3 alleged mpg advantage based on government testing which no one in their right mind believes are remotely accurate.
Since MPG keeps being mentioned, here are the results of PUTC under 30,000 dollar shootout. Please note, these are 4x2 trucks.
1. F150 5.0 V8 21.2 mpg
2. Ram 5.7 V8 19.0 mpg
3. Nissan 5.6 V8 18.8 mpg
4. Chevy 5.3 V8 18.7 mpg
5. Tundra 5.7 V8 18.0 mpg

In the real world, the 5.3 Chevy was in 4th place in fuel economy.

Lets look at performance:
1/4 mile time/speed
1. F150 15.48 sec/93.31 mph
2. Tundra 15.7 sec/91.94 mph
3. Ram 15.76 sec/89.64
4. Titan 0.2 seconds faster than last place Chevy
5. Chevy

7% grade
1. Tundra 17.55 sec/78.14 mph
2. F150 17.96 sec/77.25 mph
3. Ram 18.29 sec/77.99 mph
4. Nissan 19.24 sec/73.99 mph
5. Chevy 19.35 sec/ 70.92 mph

In the real world, the Chevy 5.3 was dead last in performance.

6. The last PUTC 1/2 ton shootout put the Ford F150 in first place. That was done with the 5.4 which in comparison to the other trucks in that shootout is grossly underpowered.

7. The Ram 1500 won the "Under 30,000" Best value shootout.
8. You ever wonder why GMC never sent a 5.3 to do battle in any of the truck shootouts ?
That is because they (GM) knows it will loose badly!

9. I don't see GM winning that many tests. Sure, it has won with the Duramax, but have you ever wondered why Ford HD outsells it 2 to 1? or why Ram Cummins HD outsells it in Canada?

10. This is the best post I've ever read as to why SFA is king.


Quote "Clearly you are not an Engineer. OR if you are, you are a GM Engineer, in which case you know who I am.
Clearly you have never taken a vehicle into a "serious Off-Road" situation.
Clearly you are a GM fan and will not look outside your own favorites.

"Anyone who actually thinks you need a straight axle instead of a independent axle for a heavy duty truck is a complete idiot and don't know what the heck they are talking about."

Okay. You start with a personal attack, generally a sign that you have no facts and that the discussion is emotional, not rational. Can you provide some facts to support your claim?
Let's talk physics:
CV joint half-shafts have the greatest torque capacity and life-span when operated at a neutral angle. As the input/output angle increases, there is a decrease in torque capacity and longevity.
IFS systems must use a CV joint and because of the design as torque is transferred through the half-shafts there is a natural tenancy for the half shaft to try and twist. On IFS systems this generally results in the front wheels twisting turning towards one another, resulting in bent tie-rods. The resulting bent tie-rods WERE common in off-road use of GMT-400s and GMT-800s. The tie-rod size was slightly increased for the GMT-900s.
We can discuss the dynamics of an IFS system in actual use vs. theory and the trade-offs against a SFA suspension, but I suspect that might be too advanced.

"Someone actually posted video's of GM trucks that had tie rod failures while pulling a heavy sled. What the He double L does the weak tie rod have to do with the independent suspension??? "

Why don't you ask the Engineering Development team about the GMT-900s? Especially the HD redesign.

First, the tie-rod failures are common, not just on sled pullers, but on H2s and in general off-road use.
Second, have you ever seen a drag-link failure on a SFA truck in a similar situation?
You won't. SFA support the individual wheel shafts out to the end, nearest the join so there is very little torque steer. IFS and FWD vehicles have 2 joints in the half-shafts and the torque input into the shaft always results in torque-steer. It is a design issue that will always be present.

Tie-Rod design is directly linked to the fundamentals of IFS because the Tie-Rod is the ONLY item that prevents unwanted steering deflection.

"And some people suggest that GM will never sell more HD'S because of their independent front suspension??? Excuse me? Yea, GM they don't want to sell more trucks now do they. Nope, because some moron suggested otherwise."

Ford and Dodge, both sell SFA 4x4 trucks (we can disregard the 2wd trucks because they are all IFS) and they have 70% of the market. Ford has 50% alone. So, let's consider that GM (Chevy and GMC) has the majority of the 1/2 ton market. Why then does GM not dominate the HD market? Does GM not have a better engine and transmission? Does GM not have competitive interiors, payload, towing and fuel economy?
Compare and contrast Ford trucks and the years of lousy gas engines, 6.0 and 6.4 Powerstrokes. Ford has many negatives, yet they STILL sell more.

"Serious off road vehicles do NOT have a straight axle. They have a independent front suspension that is built to take the beating of off road driving."

Are you talking about RACE TRUCKS? Purpose built, with massive amounts of wheel travel and HD components that are NOT O/E? If you are, your point is?

If you are implying that the best O/E trucks for off-road use are IFS, then you're under the influence and have ZERO reference to reality.
I could then take your same model of analysis and say:
How come all the serious race vehicles are RWD? and use that as a reason to explain why FWD is worthless.

"Gee, how did all the mags miss this fatal flaw that GM's HD's have on their trucks??? Why are the mags not saying this is wrong??? or that a straight front axle is the best??? Because it's not even a issue that's why. "

What Mags are you talking about? Are you talking about mags that target the casual truck user, the typical 1/2 ton buyer, those that NEVER go off-road or into tough situations? First, advertising is huge in the magazine world. Second, off-road magazines have been pointing out the GM IFS flaws for a very long time. Clearly you only read certain mags and base all your opinions on the thoughts of others.
GM spends a very large amount of money advertising and the same parent company owns two magazines that had completely different reviews of the GM HDs.

SFA, as we have it in the current market place, is the most durable front suspension design. It IS an issue and even GM knows it. GM redesigned the front suspension for the 2011 HDs because of the flaws in the prior IFS. They designed their new IFS to be great on pavement, good in snow, sand and on graded roads. The new IFS is not nearly as strong as the SFA competition. GM rolled the dice based on money and time. They beefed their IFS to be more competitive but didn't go to SFA because of the major frame changes that would be required. GM kept the IFS because of costs, PERIOD. Ford and Dodge have vids all over with their trucks off-road and GM avoids posting any of their trucks in tough situations.

I am a HUGE GM fan and I'd much rather have a GM truck, but I won't buy a truck that requires an alignment every time I take it off-road. I won't buy a truck that fails off-road and bends or breaks components. So, true to my own word (to GM Engineers) I rented a 2011 HD and took it off-road, where I take my trucks (a Dodge and a GM leaf-spring SFA truck). The new GM HD bent a tie rod. Yes this is anecdotal, but it is indicative of the GM IFS experience. People that never take them off-road have no idea of the GM IFS flaws.

So, Michigan Bob, take it from someone that actually uses their truck, the new GM HDs are great in many ways, but they are still sub-par off-road when compared to Ford and Dodge. Think I'm wrong, why don't you log off and actually TRY all three? Don't like it? Why don't you point out how great the IFS is to Ford and Dodge?"

Posted by: Lou | Jan 9, 2012 7:56:33 PM
@Michigan Bob -
You talk like Chevy is the best truck on the planet. I don't buy it. JD Power says the industry average is 151 problems per vehicle. Ford brand rates 140 per 100. Ford is above average. Chevy brand rates 156 per 100. Chevy is average. GMC brand rates 184 per 100. GMC is below average. Those are corporate averages. That means you have better odds of owning a reliable vehicle by purchacing a Ford. There isn't a huge difference but assuming a guy owns a "Ford" for 8 years he will see a dealer for repairs 11(11.2) times and a Chevy owner will need 12(12.48)repairs. A GMC product will need 15 (14.72) repairs. http://businesscenter.jdpower.com/news/pressrelease.aspx?ID=2011029
For 2011 Tundra, F150, and Ram 1500 are the top 3 large pickup trucks when it comes to durability.
http://businesscenter.jdpower.com/news/pressrelease.aspx?ID=2011029
As to your comment that Ford counts everything, that is pure and simple trolling. You frequent these news threads enough to know that Ford counts up to 4500 and so does Ram.
http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2011/01/the-ultimate-guide-to-us-pickup-truck-sales-in-2010.html#more
http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2010/05/a-quick-look-at-year-to-date-truck-sales-through-april-2010.html#more
Ford and Ram have similar ratio's when it comes to HD versus LD. Roughly 60/40 HD/LD. GM/Chev is roughly 80/20 LD/HD. Ram sells almost as many HD's as Silverado. Silverado 1/2 tons easily outsell Ford and Ram 1/2 tons.
Ford sells a negligible number of chassis cab trucks greater than 4500. Ford counts greater than 4500 separate.
Ram counts 4500 trucks in their sales and so does Ford. GMC doesn't make anything bigger than a 3500 (is that Ford and Ram's fault?)
Ford and Ram currently are the dominant players in the HD market in the USA.
If you look at the Canadian market. F-series is the dominant brand. They rank #1. Ram sells the most HD trucks in Canada. Ram ranks #2 brand. Sierra is #3, and Silverado #4.

Posted by: Lou | Jan 9, 2012 9:31:19 PM

Facts are facts.

Insults, name calling, and trolling are for people without any proof to back up their dellusions.

Old favorite?

Says who?

@Lou,

STOP spamming!

@ Lou,
You're fu...ing ....tarded! That's all I can say to you! You acutally keep a saved file of this. OMFG!!! Get help! Have a doctor look at your legs because it's definitely too late to save your head!!

@ Lou, And GET A JOB!!!

1st, I don't own a 1993 Chevy truck and Never have.
2nd. you have quoted me on several things I have never said.
3rd. Chevy Impala is one of many company vehicles I have driven and it's a great car and gets great gas milage and outsells every full size car in America.
4th. your post about gas milage is totally false and ford used a REGULAR CAB IN THE SHOOTOUT. and should be disqualified from the results.
5th. your argument about two wheel drive vs 4wheel drive is so full of S..T and false statements I don't know where to begin. Two wheel drive trucks are for Pu..ies.
Lou, you have been proven to be a liar and a fraud.

Lou, you have been proven to be a liar and a fraud.

i think Lou is the only one who actually post facts and not lies, unlike so many other fanboys

@Michigan Bob
Do you even own a truck? If so, what year?

@Michigan Bob:
Yeah, what year/model is your Chevy?

@Lou,
Bob is the founder of Tacoma World and is a very successful person.

There was no Chevy Silverado in 1993 so you are wrong on that.

Why are you looking up what and where people drive?????? Are you like a stalker or something?

I am beginning to think oxi was right about you.

This is pathetic!

@Dan,
Lou is a stalker.

@Michigan Bob; in the 30,000$ shootout, even if that was a super cab instead of regular cab Ford, do you REALLY think it would bring it down 2.5 MPG? Just by adding about 500 pounds? The Chevys poor performance, or maybe ok for you flatland light light haulers, mixed with it's second to last mileage, is alot more realistic. Heck, if they had a Toyota with the 4.1 gears instead of 4.3 it might even get the mileage of the Chevy. And still have it's good results. Chevys 5.3 gas mileage is HYPE. Only at 75 mph on a flat road, otherwise it's so bust downshifting to make good mileage. That's pretty bad, they didn't even print the times for Chevy and Nissan, lol. As for the truck pictured, ugly, in my opinion, The gaudy bow tie. What is it Chevy actually wins??

@Frank,

So are you my friend..

@TRX4 Tom,

Don't like it?... Get out! kids these days.

I don't quite understand the camo interior combined with carpeted bed.
If this is supposed to be a hunter's truck, one deer carcass and that carpet is toast.

Like everything about this truck minus the huge bowtie and idk bout that carpeted bed I guess on a deer camp type situation itd be nice to sleep back there but ya cant throw a deer turkey etc. back there w/o getting blood/messing up that carpet.

@Jason H
I'm not so sure Michigan Bob has a truck...He hates Ford so much that I'll bet Ford Motor Credit repossessed his Ranger!!!

@Michigan Bob
Come on Bob...spill it!!! I drive a 2005 F150 4X4...That doesn't mean I dislike Chevys...say what you want, I like it! I'll drive a Chevy if they put out a truck that I like more...maybe next year. COME ON! PUT UP OR SHUT UP!!!!!!!!!!!!

@Michigan Bob -
1st. you said you had a 93 Chevy. I had mistakenly said 5.3 and you said it was a 5.7.
2nd. You continue to lie.
3rd. You drive a Impala company car? Your not a cop, so you are either a taxi driver or salesman. Both rate real hig on the pecking order of respectable ocupations.
4th. Even if you removed the F150 from the shootout - the 5.3 would still be in 3rd place. All of the trucks in the shootout were 4x2.
5th. I can post an arguement for the pros and cons of 4x4 versus 4x2, can you?
As far as we know - you don't even own a truck, or are too embarassed to state what you drive!

Please point out anywhere in my long post that I lied?

@Greg J - I do have an excellent job. I have tons of free time. Do I have to post my tax returns ?
Saving this file?
Anything that is posted is stored on this site. It is very easy to go back a few threads and re-post.
If you or Bob or anyother broken record wants to bring up the same old emotional completely fabricated arguments over and over again, I'll keep re-using the facts.

Most the time Michigan Bob is telling us how (insert brand name here) is copying GM. Once again, GM coppying somebody else. Oh hey Bob, Impala doesn't outsell Fusion. I think it sell half as many as Fushions. The Charger 8 speed will be beating the Impala soon. They can't get them out fast enough! As usual, GM will do good on sales due to being lower cost, and willing to take alot less for it.


Michigan Bob must be out delivering Domino's pizza...

Lou, Put up or SHUT UP. I never ever said I own a 1993 Chevy truck. I don't know where you getting that crap but never have. Show me where I said I own 93 truck??? Never did, but alot of people are using my name so maybe you got it from some punk claiming to be me.

Secondly, I don't owe you a dam thing. Your just a Ford slappy that has been bashing GM for as long as I have read this board.

And S..T for brains TRX4 Tom, the Impala is a FULL SIZE CAR AND DOES OUTSELL EVERY LARGE CAR IN America. If fact the Chevy Impala is GM'S largest selling name plate in history for you ignorant ones.

Fusion is midsize, not full size. The Charger anything can't outsell GM'S Chevy Malibu, Cruze or Impala. Charger, what a joke.

Lou, are you on welfare that you play on the computer all day??? Are you a Obama supporter??? Probably are and you probably are a leach on society.

he drives a Yota

One day the TROLL will go away!

Frank

he yells a lot just like a dog bark is worse than his bite

lol so Bob, the Impala is the best selling full size car? A couple articles ago you posted about how Ford sells the most, but that is like McDonald's vs Wendy's, or something silly like that. So is the impala like Mcdonalds, but you still prefer Wendy's? Like you said before, best in sales doesn't mean best in the business. Toyota Camry is the best selling car, you're trying to tell me it's the best car out there? No way. Same for the F-150, same for everything. Sales doesn't mean it's the tops, it just means it's probably pretty good. This goes for all brands, all trucks, everything.

@Dan,

His bark is loud but his bite isn't vicious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GllI_tQSCNk gm FTW!!

@Frank,

Kinda seems like you.

@Bob,

You are the TROLL CHAMP!!!! Goodbye TROLL! Go AWAY!

@Frank,

Blah, Blah, Blah... Whatever.

It's time for your bedtime, Pre-school starts early tommorow.

@Bob,

D - E - N - I - A - L

IT LOOKS LIKE FRANKIE IS AT IT AGAIN.

I came home hoping to read some good posts in here, and much to my disappointment I find a huge string of BS being spewed by Frank, aka the BIGGEST TROLL ON PUTC.

@Frank is a troll,

Bob, you keep making yourself look like a total moron. Keep up the good work!

You are a typical cry baby......

"I came home hoping to read some good posts in here, and much to my disappointment I find a huge string of BS being spewed by Frank, aka the BIGGEST TROLL ON PUTC."

You are a fvcken troll and you know it! I get a good laugh out of your sorry a$$!

@Bob

So come on, why won't you tell anybody what you drive? He's so embarrassed he won't even put up a make or year! Who wants to bet he actually drives a toyota!

@Bob's Huge Weiner,


I thought i made it clear what i drive in previous threads.

BTW, How's that Scion holdin' up for Ya'?

@Michigan = (lucky the refs like them instead of the Virginia Tech player that CAUGHT the ball) Bob: and YOU call me S..T for brains? Wow, you really should read more then what's on here, and what your salesman tells you to believe Impala is a best seller! WAY OFF! Yeah, the names been around. I give you that. You should do some research before you run your mouth! You're gonna think the Charger is a joke! The biggest joke is YOU!

@Frank,

How do you know that I am Bob? Might want to think again, Troll Boy.

man i remember when people in the threads used to actually say something when they would talk



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