2015 Ford Super Duty F-350: Quick Comparison

1 Group One-Tons II

We know it created quite a stir last week when we posted some test data we collected from the media launch of the 2015 Ford Super Dutys in West Virginia.

Through a combination of luck and skill (and maybe just a touch of deception), we were able to take out the two monster pullers from the heavy-duty segment — meaning the two vehicles that have and are now heavily promoting themselves to have the highest maximum fifth-wheel/gooseneck towing numbers — for a quick-and-dirty back-to-back hill-climb test with some VBOX test equipment.

To its credit, Ford had several competitor, similarly equipped, vehicles with various types of fifth-wheel and bumper-pull trailers on hand for us to sample throughout the event. We thought you might be interested in those results, so we're giving you the numbers here (see below). Full disclosure: Speeds and measurements were taken from visual verification of factory speedometer readings and not from our VBOX test equipment; data also came from manufacturer price sheets and tags on the rear axles that we could verify. All the one-ton fifth-wheel towing vehicles did have 3.73:1 gears, the manufacturer's max-output turbo-diesel engine and all the appropriate towing options.

The only thing we could not verify were the exact weights of the trucks and trailers, but after visually inspecting and noting the compensating sandbag weights in the beds of the trucks where necessary, we're confident that each fifth-wheel camper trailer was comparable with each Chevrolet, Ram and Ford one-ton dualie crew cabs.

 

2 F-350 Montana II

 

We should note that the factory ratings of these vehicles do not include anyone's maximum towing or gross vehicle or gross combined weight rating numbers; however, because they are all crew cab one-tons with 3.73:1 gearing and automatics with their highest-output turbodiesels, the numbers should all be relatively close. 

This was a relatively unscientific look at the Chevy Silverado HD versus the Ford Super Duty versus the Ram HD. As many of you know, we are preparing one of the most comprehensive HD comparison tests PickupTrucks.com has ever done as we write this, but those much more organized and rigorous test results will be coming in just a few weeks. For now, this will have to do.

To conduct this test we took each identically setup one-ton HD pickup (the 2015 Chevy Silverado 3500 Duramax, the 2014 Ram 3500 HD Cummins and the 2015 Ford F-350 Power Stroke) on a stretch of Interstate 64 near the New River Gorge in West Virginia and matched a starting speed of 65 mph at a designated point at the base of a long, 7 percent grade; we then went to wide-open throttle to check speeds at two separate designated signposts one mile and one-and-a-half miles up the road. Here are the results.

Cars.com photos by Mark Williams and Bruce Smith

 

Wv-chart

 

4 F-350 Montana II

3 F-350 Montana II

 

Comments

Congratulation. RAM won again.

The DuraMax still spanking Furd and Cummins after both have had bumps in power/torque, the Furd motor had to be redesigned only after a few years to push 440HP and even with huge advantages in Pixie Dust HP and TQ the Allison Durmax still blows Furd away. Congrats to Cummins for keeping up.

Really has to do with transmission ratios. Probably why the Ram was so much slower at 1.1 miles. I'd like to know the spacing of the trucks at the end.

The Duramax is still giving the competition a run for their money! Chevy is still a beast

Mr O, more than likely because that weak azz allison has less hp loss going through it. Like I said, speed at any 1 point doesn't tell the whole story.

says they used two mile markers to set time, and they were starting out at 65, looks like the chevy was going 68 at start and ford still won

People are too obsessed with axle gears. Transmission gears are the other half of the equation. If we're going to see what each 1 ton can really do, lets get 4.10 in the Ram and whatever Ford's top gears are. I am a Ram guy, and I know the Ram will still be the slowest, but lets make a real comaprison here.

@joedirte go back and read the article, the graph was hard to read but from the very little information they gave us it the trucks started at 65 and drove one mile at full throttle from 137.6 to 136.4 at that point the ford was ahead by 1MPH, then they drove 1.5 miles further 136.4 to 135.0 and at that point the Chevy was eating the Dodge and Ford's lunch by 4 and 3 MPH respectively. On a 7% grade that is a huge margin. Especially coming back from a 1MPH deficit to the Ford in just 1.5 miles, that means the Chevy was 5MPH faster than the Ford over 1.5Miles on a 7% grade. Again, that's quite impressive for being down by some 50HP and nearly 100lbsft of torque.

Cant wait for the HD Shootout!

this test does nothing for me

Well at least you didn't use an F450 this time.

All this snapshot does is tell me that despite all the hoopla about Ford and Ram being the "2 Best" in the market, Chevrolet is more than holding it's own with "less HP and Torque" than either of those 2. I think the media has bought into the B.S. that Ford and Ram are spewing about their power numbers and Chevrolet has kept quiet in the background, while still kicking ass. Growing up, the kids who talked the most about how big their D**** were, usually were the ones with the smallest ones. I think that applies here.

GM has been kicking Ford and Ram's ass in these Shootouts for years even with "less power." For Pickuptrucks.com to only do a shootout with Ford and Ram is pretty weak and goes to prove the lack of professionalism they suffer from. Why run an article on just those 2? I know they're doing a shootout with all 3, but that article about Ford and Ram is misleading, at best. I think GM has proven they can hold their own over the last 10 years in this market and class and their trucks should always be included in any comparison testing. But then again, this site is owned and paid for by Ford (Mike Levine), so I wouldn't expect anything less than the constant Ford propaganda we've been getting.

Fact is, the Duramax is the same since 2011, while Ford has redesigned the Powerjoke twice and it still cant beat Duramax, how embarrassing to be a Furd engineer with the Super Duty frame that twists like a pretzel and a weak engine block in the redesign the first time so to get just 40HP out of it they had to redesign the block again HAHA.

Then lets talk about all those SD's on the road with their Azz's hanging in the back, looks like they are permanently going up a steep grade.

Or the, you have to take the Cab off to do major engine work, what a joke, the best never rest.

At the end of the day, you gotta ask yourself "how many truck consumers are gonna max out their towing capacity often? And if so, go with the next size up truck. F450, F550 or bigger Ram.
To me reliability is important as well as operating costs if I'm running a business. Then add styling to mostly the consumer. There's only a smaller bunch of people that need that sheet of paper that say theirs is bigger & bad'er.

again this test does nothing for me, I currently own a 2011 f250 diesel, I drove all of them when I bought, this test is so vague, if you were to test them from a dead stop it would be much different, the reason why I went Ford this time was because of the crazy pull power and all around liked the truck better, the reason I didn't buy the GM twins, small cabs, lackluster interiors, and the duramax, although an awesome engine, didn't feel near as good as the powerstroke, which in the HD market look at the sales numbers, people are buying more Fords and Rams than the twins for many other reasons than the towing factor.....

Looks to me that the Ford's turbo peeters out on the high side of the rpm range and is more of a low end power turbo. Although Ford at the lead in mph at the first mile marker, it lost quite a bit at the second. GM did really well although their diesels are known for their top end WOT power. Cummins held its own too. As I said before I have no dog in this fight, but it is still interesting to watch. Can't wait for the heavy duty challenge results.

I think its funny how GM guys can be proud of there Heinz 57 truck. Ford is the only truck that builds their own Diesel and transmission let me say again the only one. When Chevy or dodge start to build their own diesels then they can talk. Lets get one thing straight Chevy doesn't build duramax or dodge don't build Cummings. Ford makes the best trucks period.

I was there. Right after the test the Ram had a injector pump fail. why did they not include this in the story?

@Cory
" Ford makes the best trucks period."
I agree with that. It leaks once a month regularly.


Cory, Ford building their own engine is a way to cheap out and not let engine building up to the experts and companies that have been doing it for 50 years, this is why the Ford's have some many problems with their motors. Cummins and Duramax are both high quality names with strong reputations behind them.

@R3NxSTONEx
Since you were there then you must of also saw how the DMAX ended up leaving on a tow truck due to a blown head gasket. They didn't include that part either

Cory,
DMax Ltd., which builds Duramax 6.6-liter V8 engine, is a joint venture between GM and Isuzu. GM owns 60% and Isuzu 40%.
In that respect I would say GM builds their own diesel engine since they own majority of DMax.

That said, I can't wait for full results of this challenge. I hope PUTC won't leave anything untouched.

@joe,

Ford has been building engines since 1893.

If raw speed were the only criteria then these tests would be conclusive. Instead, they are one factor in the purchase decision. Having used several trucks and brands to tow a fiftwheel similar to those in this test around the country for our eleven years of fulltiming, I have a pretty good feel for what is important, to me at least. Being able to pull that big hill at reasonable speed is certainly one factor. Another is reliability. How hot does the engine and transmission run on those grades? What rpm? The Cummins, being an inline six, runs far less rpm and far cooler than the other two. The Duramax and Powerstroke are screaming as they climb the hill at 3800 rpm and probalby 225 to 235 degrees of engine temperature. The Cummins, on the other hand, is running probably 2500 rpm and maybe 215 degrees max. Not only does far less heat and lower rpm translate to better longevity and reliability, it's also a much more relaxed towing experience. Some won't care about anything other than raw speed. For them, you can see which truck you should buy. For those of us interested more in the overall experience and life of the truck buy the Ram. I'm sure others here will have a different opinion. This one is mine, based on years of towing.

Time for me to head over to Ford and lend them some more fairy dust to boost HP again for their 2016s; this time to a magical 500hp. -Tink

Very intriguing, but does show that they're all roughly equivalent. The Ford does show the quickest acceleration but lost it quickly to the Chevy which managed to hold its speed better. On the other hand, the Ram showed the fact that it's a steady and strong puller, not gaining much at the 1-mile mark, but also not losing as much at the end of the run compared to the other two. I'm thinking the Ram would probably top out over the others at another 1-2 miles on that long grade and end up in front.

What's more intriguing though is the fact that the Ford towed one brand of trailer while the Chevy and Ram towed a different brand. While there may be little difference overall between the three, it seems questionable that they would do that unless they thought it would give them some--albeit slight--advantage.

I'm a very satisfied owner of a 2014 Longhorn 2500 6.4 but if I was going diesel I would likely go with a Duramax. Not because this little, unofficial test showed it to be faster but because GM has been doing a great job of maximizing this combination in every way.

I think they're all pretty amazing vehicles now and it's smart to use existing parts to make a vehicle. I have no issue with in house design at all but I don't see how having to redesign a diesel 4 times in a decade as being efficient. Having said that I see plenty of 6.7 Fords in the patch now and they are reliable.

If you give me any make for free I'll gladly use it lol

Are there any plans to hook these trucks up to a dyno to measure their power to the rear wheels?

Good job Ford and GM.

Ram couldn't get past 71 mph.

No Guts

No Glory

@nitro: Why would testing the trucks from a dead stop be so different? Are you planning to haul a heave 5th-wheel trailer around through city streets all the time?

No, actually road hauling is what these trucks are supposedly built for and what I typically see them used for. I see more of these heavy haulers either loaded and pulling twelve-foot tall stacks of hay or carrying anywhere from three to five cars on a long trailer with the full weight of at least two cars right over the axle. When hauling that kind of weight around, how quickly you get to speed is unimportant--you simply don't want to accelerate such a load under full power from a dead start or you'll risk losing your load. On the other hand, the ability to maintain speed on a grade is far more important and of the three--despite the claimed breakdowns by at least one commenter here.

Also (this to all readers), FCA/RAM, GM and Ford all are at least part owners of the diesel engine manufacturers they use and at least one is full owner of another that's used in their lighter vehicles. Pickup trucks are undergoing a significant shift in capabilities right now and any advantage one holds at any given moment will be lost to one of the others for the same reason. There is no "best truck" any more, only one that is "best" for a short time before overtaken by the others. This will HAVE to change, as they cannot continue to grow without losing their Class 2, 3 and 4 ratings. Already these Heavy Duty models infringe on Class 5 capabilities and could end up reclassified simply because they are so strong. Of course, that then means that each model will likely end up going one class higher, leaving room for a new Class 2 truck that may take on a 100/1000 nameplate for the brands and maybe a Class 1 taking on a 50/500 nameplate. GM is already introducing one slightly-downsized truck and I'm willing to bet the others will do so as well within the next 2-3 years.

@RoadWhale

Looking at the pic of the three different Fifth wheels being towed, the advantage would have been to Dodge and GM. The unit towed by the Ford in the photos is both taller and has a more upright profile than the other two. At higher speeds, aerodynamics make a HUGE difference in fuel consumption, and therefore performance.

I am surprised the Dmax was faster that the powerstroke. Wouldnt buy a GM but still impressive. I am not surprised about the cummins as it has the lowest HP numbers. HP will get you up the hill faster while torque will hold you there.

Mark and Crew,

Welcome to West Virginia. Hope you enjoyed your stay in our wonderful state.

Keep up the testing.

Can you get an aison equipped cummins with 3.73's? I thought the aisin equipped trucks were 3.42's or 4.10's.

I see the Ram listed as a 2015 Model, guessing that this is really a 2014?

Love these tests but seriously should have had three identical trailers. Just my opinion....thanks

It is a quick and dirty little test. Too bad the grade ran out when it did. Looks like the Cummins motor stiffened up and dug the deepest of the 3 as the deceleration of the Ford and Chevy were at least twice as much as the Ram. Were those V-8's running out of breath? Yeah, I'm a Ram fan.

HA 13 year old Duramax still throwing a good whooping on the brand new Ford even with less HP and TQ don't get no better then that LOL!

I like the numbers o the 2.7 EB http://wot.motortrend.com/2015_ford_f_150_2_7l_ecoboost_rated_325_hp_375_lb_ft_tows_max_8500_lbs.html as I was close when I guessed 310hp/365lb ft but does anybody know what rpm the peak torques comes across?

@AD,

It will be around 3500 RPM.

This worthless test explains perfectly why big rigs gear down and head for that extra right lane. Far safer to get there in one piece than to brag about how fast you can climb a steep grade.

Here's the test I'd like to see; the big three trucks, three drivers. Each driver paired up with a truck/trailer starts down in Denver and drives the combo to Silverthorne and back to Denver. Then rotate drivers until each driver has driven each combo over the "hill" and back. That would give each driver enough time in the saddle to offer meaningful feedback on the characteristics of each truck.

@AD, thanks for posting that info! I read somewhere the torque peaked as early as 2500rpm on the new 2.7. Hopefully it will have the same output (or higher) in the Edge Sport. Ford is making awesome products right now, I can't wait for the 2016 Super Duty. Despite the Duramax being peppy for drag racing, the rest of the truck is a let down. The rear seats suck, they still believe in Bose stereos, and it's not a pretty truck to look at either. Ugliess and toughness are not the same thing. I would go with Ram or Ford. If I were pulling a big 5th wheel around the country, my priorities would be reliability and fuel economy. Nonetheless, it will be interesting to read the shootout and watch TFL Truck's Ike Gauntlet with the new Ford.

@R3NxSTONEx
Since you were there then you must of also saw how the DMAX ended up leaving on a tow truck due to a blown head gasket. They didn't include that part either

@Ford1

I did then the comedy ensued when the Ram tow truck blew a rear end trying to tow the DMAX

But in the end all tragedies get resolved... two mighty FORD super duty's came and removed the junk.

Then there was a brief unexpected rain shower followed by a rainbow and believe it or not the end of the rainbow was cast directly over the FORD SUPERDUTY!

@AD

Thanks for posting that.


A Ford truck driver would amuse himself by running over Ram drivers that were working on their trucks by the side of the road. Whenever he saw a Ram on the side of the road, he would swerve to hit whoever was standing around the opened hood. He would enjoy the satisfying "THUMP", and then swerve back onto the road.

One day, as the Ford man was driving along he saw a priest hitchhiking. He thought he would do a good turn and pulled the truck over.

He asked the priest, "Where are you going, Father?"

"I'm going to the church 5 miles down the road," replied the priest.

"No problem, Father! I'll give you a lift. Climb in the truck." The happy priest climbed into the passenger seat and the Ford man continued down the road.

Suddenly Old Ford boy saw a broken down Ram with the hood up and a butt-crack standing on the side of the road. The Ford driver instinctively swerved to hit him. But then he remembered there was a priest in the truck with him, so at the last minute he swerved back into his lane, narrowly missing the ole boy. However, even though he was certain he missed him, he still heard a loud "THUD". Not understanding where the noise came from he glanced in his mirrors and when he didn't see anything, he turned to the priest and said, "I'm sorry Father, I almost hit that Ram truck driver."

"I know", replied the priest. "But don't worry, I got him with the door!"

@JRT -

Do you understand maximum piston speed?

Engines have a maximum piston velocity that is attainable before they fly apart.

The Cummins 6.7 has a bore of 4.21 and stroke of 4.88. It is a long stroke or undersquare motor.
It will make more torque down low but will not do as well at higher rpm.

The Ford 6.7 V8 has a bore of 3.9 and stroke of 4.25. It is also undersquare but not nearly as much as the Cummins.

Finally we have the GM 6.6 with a bore of 4.06 and 3.9 stroke. It has a larger bore than stroke. It is undersquare. This configuration tends to be higher revving and makes more power at higher rpm.

If one looks at peak HP and torque per engine:

Cummins 6.7
- manual trans = 350hp @ 2,800 rpm/660lbft @ 1,500 rpm
- 68RFE trans = 370 hp @ 2,800 rpm/800lbft @ 1,700 rpm
- Aisin trans = 385 hp @ 2,800 rpm/850lbft @ 1,700 rpm

Ford 6.7
- 2010-2014 = 400hp @ 2,800 rpm/800lbft @ 1,600 rpm
- 2015 = 440hp @2,800 rpm/860lbft @ 1,600 rpm

GM 6.6
- LML = 397hp @ 3,000 rpm/765lbft @ 1,600 rpm.

You say that the GM and Ford engines are screamers BUT the Cummins produces peak HP at the same RPM as Ford and 200 rpm less than the GM. It also puts out peak torque 100 rpm higher than both the Ford and GM.

We'd have to pull up graphs of the power characteristics of all three engines but in reality if the Cummins is turning slower than the Ford or GM to do the same job the piston velocity is going to be higher than that of the Ford or GM at the same RPM.

The advantage to the Cummins is that it was first designed as an industrial truck engine. That accounts for its durability but emissions have hurt it.

All1's comment tends to align with what I said. The GM being a short stroke motor gains ground the higher it is able to rev.
The Ford being more "square" seems to split the difference between the 2 engines.
The Cummins doesn't build speed as fast but its longer stroke and torque characteristics helps it maintain speed better.

GM has the oldest and most proven design.
- JD Power gives them the best rating followed by Ford and then Ram.

GM has fixed many of the interior issues that I did not like. They've improved the frame and upgraded the looks. I still do not like the low hanging frame but my brother has gone through three of them (and just as many Ford and Dodge trucks) to say that in reality it isn't a huge impediment. He did say that he felt that the Ram rides better. The DEF tank placement is an issue rectified with an aftermarket skid plate.

Even though GM has been hit by a massive amount of recalls, the GM truck would be at the top of my list for purchase due to its durability ratings and "end of model" design. Traditionally "end of model" drivetrains are more reliable than newer versions.
I do not think that GM will win but obviously it is in the hunt and despite Ram and Ford's "my package is bigger than your package" advertising, the GM is a contender.

Wow, that 2.7L would be perfect in a Jeep Wrangler.

RAM JUST ANNOUNCED:

Ram is looking at reinventing the tailgate, albeit along the lines of venerable van setups. A Chrysler patent filed on February 20, 2013, by five different inventors (Danja McGoff, David Anderson, Gary Bastian, Trevor Garvey, and Eugene Paik), shows a split tailgate which can either open wide, like a door, or be laid down like a traditional truck tailgate. Ram is also introducing a manufacturer first ,Heated tailgates so customers hands do not get cold when pushing their trucks home or to the nearest service department.

As Allpar previously reported, the individual tailgate-halves, or “doors,” can be actuated by touchpads. They can be operated together, as a single tailgate unit, or separately, as a pair of doors.

ANOTHER HUGE RAM ANNOUNCEMENT:

Did you hear that RAM is giving away a free dog with every purchase ! That way you have a friend to walk with you the rest of the way home!

what are the last two pages in the Ram manual?

The bus schedule.



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