Toyota's Response to Tundra Frame Rust Investigation Due

Toyota's Response to Tundra Frame Rust Investigation Due

Toyota's response to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration's probe into reports of severe frame rust and corrosion problems in 2000-01 Tundra pickups is due to the federal agency on Friday, Nov. 20.

NHTSA opened the investigation in October, after receiving 20 complaints related to the spare tire mount rusting to the point where the spare tire fell off the vehicle and broken brake lines leading to brake failure. But as of Nov. 19, NHTSA had published nearly 300 complaints to its website. More than 70 complaints have been reported since the investigation was announced.

Toyota has been asked to turn over all documentation that it has collected or generated internally related to the problems, including field reports, consumer complaints and lawsuit or third-party arbitration summaries.

Rear Of Frame Looking Forward

"The information requested by NHTSA in the Information Request dated 10/9/09 is due today, not necessarily a response [to the complaints] from Toyota," said Brian Lyons, Toyota's Safety and Quality Communications Manager. "The requirements per the Information Request have been fulfilled."

Toyota has been studying the issue for more than six months and has repurchased several Tundras from owners as part of its investigation process, though no formal repair program has been put in place.

Most rust-damaged Tundras have been reported in what Toyota defines as 20 severe cold-weather states, like Massachusetts, where brutal winter road conditions can take their toll on under-protected metal.

2000 was the Toyota Tundra’s first model year as a replacement for the earlier Toyota T100 pickup. The first Tundras were built in 1999. In 2000, 100,455 were sold, and another 108,863 were sold in 2001.

Tundra frame rust complaints are the latest ding against Toyota. In September, Toyota issued an urgent warning to remove driver's side floor mats from 3.8 million Toyota and Lexus vehicles after a family was killed when their Lexus ES350 experienced sudden acceleration.


Updated 11-20-2009 at 9:45 am PDT with quote from Toyota


Man oh man, this is Toyata quality and reliability? rusting frames on there trucks? And what abot the past recalls not to mention the gas pedaal issue. Also there snapping camshafts, driveshaft recall, and balljoint recalls. Again you want a real truk buy Ram or Ford. Toyota should just pull out of the truck market period. I got a feeling this is not the end of there problems.

Hunters Run, sounds like you know these people pretty well, like I said they people who make these comments usually are hiding something.

I am amazed that the "inferior" T100 hasnt been the target of any such claims,whereas the "improved" Tundra has.I thought vehicles were supposed to get better,not worse.
Toyota has had frame issues since the 1970s.Many HiLux pickups have snapped in two thanks to flimsy build and not being made for the US market.Its amazing that the body can be made to resist rust (look at the photo),yet the frame (which is made of steel as well),cant be protected any better.Wasnt it Land Rover in the old days that used aluminum bodies and galvanized steel frames??

Guy's ,my girlfriend had a 2000 Tundra !! So Tundra's are chick trucks as well...

She was brain washed about Toyota's quality that they never break..cough..cough..It broke within the first 5,000 miles ,left her stranded at night..5'4 102 lbs 26 year old blonde ,not impressed about being stranded.. Then she wised up when we started to date and owns a black 2005 Dodge Ram 1500 Rumble Bee !! I remember in 2004 when changing the oil on the 20,000 mile Tundra it looked pretty rusty,and we live on the Pacific Coast no salt,no snow ect..spent only 1 winter in Montana..the Ram is solid no rust under/anywhere at my old Ford lighning never rusted nor my 2006 Dodge Ram SRT-10 quadcab is still as new !!!

So..maybe now when your pedal gets stuck on your Tundra you can stomp on the floor and fall through the rust I would asume if the strongest point of the truck rusts like mad the floor boards should be brittle too!!The Toyota Echo had rusty floorboards,thats why they renamed them fool you !!

Dang that looks bad. Toyota needs to buy back all of these trucks from the customers. Makes you say "Im glad I didnt get on the Toyota bandwagon now." Go Ford, Ram, GM trucks!!!

I live up here in good old, but cold, Nova Scotia Canada and I've owned a few Toyotas in my time. I've had an 83 pickup, an 88 4runner, a 1990 pickup, a 1993 pickup, two 1993 T100s (one of which I still have), a 1999 Tacoma, an 01 Tundra, an 06 Sequoia and now an 08 Tundra. I never had a major issue with any of them. Not one. Great trucks. I will buy nothing else.

I don't know if there are many other places out there where they use more vehicle killing salt on their roads than here. It's just brutal. It will kill any car or truck on the road if they are not taken care of. I've seen rusted out Fords, Rams, GMCs, Chevys, Nissans and yes, Toyotas. It's gonna happen if you do not protect your investment. I rust check my vehicles every year, like everyone SHOULD in an area where there are weather conditions like this. Like I said, ya gotta protect your investment. If your ten year old truck is rusting out because you didn't protect it, and you live in an area like I, than I have little sympathy for you.

BTW - I haven't had transmission problems, camshaft problems or any of the other stuff you guys are mentioning on here whereas friends of mine with their Chevy's (of same or similar years) have gone through brakes, tires, headlights, tailights, universals among their issues.

Lot's of talk about the frames rusting out on the Tundra but it seems the frame rusting and buy back program of the Tacoma has been forgotten. Also, why no mention of the original small Toyota truck frames rusting out? Models from the 70s & 80s were just as bad on rusting out too.

I live in the areas that Toyata is talking about and there are no rotted frames on Rams, Ford or GMs. And no we dont have to do "rust check" on those trucks. We know they will be ok because they are not made of inferior steel like Toyotas. The photo above says it all, period, and so do the recalls. Toyotas have taken a BIG hit lately and they should. They have some big problems. All from trying to get too big too fast. They have even admitted it. The Toyota cool aid is all gone!

I'd have to agree to a certain degree with Ric17. The owner of any vehicle has to take some personal responsibility for the mechanical condition of their own vehicle. If you notice your vehicle is rusting faster than it should, irregardless of brand, would you leave it until the vehicle turned into a death trap? The scary answer to that question is.... yes, many people do just that. I live in an area with long crappy winters with heavy road salt use. I haven't seen any difference in rusting among any of the vehicle brands. I'm not trying to come up with excuses for Toyota as they need to do something about this. Unfortunately we have become a society where we do not accept personal responsibility for the problems we've caused. How much of this problem is due to people not using good, old, common sense? To be truthful I don't like the term common sense as it is really all too uncommon!
Corporate Toyota - pull your heads out of your asses before you ruin your company.

Frame rust is a serious problem that Toyota must address. After speaking with quite a few people who own 2000-2003 Tundras, it's clear that:

1. The frame rust issue is most pronounced in the N.E.
2. Most owners claim that they maintained their Tundras the same way they maintained their other vehicles, yet only their Tundra has frame rust.
3. In case you missed it, I said 2000-2003. This problem is not limited to just 00 and 01.

Hopefully Toyota does the right thing today and warranties and/or repurchases these rusted trucks. Anything less is a disappointment.

FYI these rusting, rotting Toyota frames are made here by a manufacturer in the US. Much like the Dana made axles for the Titan that gave Nissan problems.

Ric17.....You say your friend had problems with his !!! Thats just routine maintenance !!! I guess you do not put any km on your Toyota trucks, not to even put a set of tires or do the brakes ,any vehicle needs those !!! Depends how you drive them,even the exact vehicle with different drivers needs maintenance at different mileage. For example I can go through a set of back tires in 5 minutes on my 510 hp Dodge Ram SRT if I wanted too !!!

I guess you lucked out, my Moms side of the family owned a Toyota Dealer from the late 70's to early 2001 its now a multi make new/used/sales/lease dealer...and The 1990's 4 runner were notorious for blowing head first ride was my moms 1994 2 year old 4Runner first head gasket 18,000 babied by my mom..then I drove it at 50,000 head gasket(cracked head) then 70,000 the engine blew,fixed it ..then trans and differential went out..all under 80k then bought a Dodge Ram SST (ordered through the Toyota dealer lol)drove it harder than the Toyota eg..I did smoke shows with the Ram Toyota was a slow beast could not spin the tires ..The Ram ,I blew the drive shaft out at 88,000 miles 4 sets of rear tires (I love smoke shows)Then my Ford Lightning drove it 50,000 trouble free, again brake pads and tires..Now I baby my Ram SRT and my Girl has a Dodge Rumble Bee both just oil changes and never any issues...

Due to "brutal road condition" - are the kidding? This frame is piece of s**t - solid rust protection is a relevant issue on ANY kind of car, that you're buying in Europe, even Toyota!

don't want Ram it got not company now. Ford burn up. oh was that the hood that pop up too?

Thank god I have a Dodge, I don't have to worry about my tires ever wearing out. Apparantly Toyotas don't wear out tires either?

Just like the one comment said...look at the rust...but...look at the seperated leaf spring from the frame...Just goes to show you Toyota's are simply for "looks" only..The first 3 letters on the tailgate says it all.."TOY"...All looks and no long term durabulity whatsoever. I'll stick to GM, Ford or Dodge anyday.

Keith said "FYI these rusting, rotting Toyota frames are made here by a manufacturer in the US. Much like the Dana made axles for the Titan that gave Nissan problems."

Keith- I'm sorry, but chassis and drivetrain parts are not anyone's fault but the auto manufacturer. Koyo makes the radiator on my brother's Honda. If the radiator fails prematurely at 25k mi., he's not going to be looking at the manufacturer's code on the radiator, he'll be blaming Honda, as he rightfully should. It is the responsibility of the auto manufacturers to specify engineering requirements for the parts they contract out to suppliers, and it is the auto manufacturer's job to verify that these parts meet spec.

Toyota chose that frame manufacturer and accepted their parts. Toyota chose that axle manufacturer and accepted their parts. Any problems with the vehicle resulting from those parts is the fault of Toyota and nobody else. Nice try, though.

I had a chevy 1500 4x4 that had cracks in the frame the rust was so bad. Spare tire carrier was gone and who knows ahat else. I fishplated what I could then sold the thing. The 2001 era chevy trucks also rust really bad around the lower door edges and rear wheel wells. I dont hear chevy doing anything about it. Toyota bought back tacomas with bad frames. Dont hear anyone else doing that. The thing with toyota is that they work to make their products better. The new trucks they sell are built from the factory to withstand rust. Ive owned every brand of truck except Nissan and the only ones I would buy again are a Ford or a Toyota. The fords have the best frames of any out there. I love chevy trucks but the bodies and frames just dont hold up. Dodge is out of the question. Never going to drive one of those again unless its a heavy duty with a cummins. Dont hate on toyota. They build some of the best trucks in the world. And unlike other manufactorers, they accept their mistakes, fix them, and learn from them. Ford is doing that now and you all can see the difference it is making in the sales.

Toyota should just sell the Hilux here and be done with it .

I live in the rust belt of the northeast and had a 1980 F-150 and a 1997 F-250 HD. I never had a problem with rust. Didn't do anything special with it either. Blaming the rusting frames on the owner is a cop out. I have also read on TH that people with 2007+ Tundras had some rust issues already. But it will probably take a few more years for those to rust through and for Toyota to do something. Same old same old.

Ric17 said "Like I said, ya gotta protect your investment. If your ten year old truck is rusting out because you didn't protect it, and you live in an area like I, than I have little sympathy for you."

Ric17- you need to consider this compared to other vehicles. I lived in Alaska for 23 years, where they use very harsh salt and gravel, and our now 17 year old Ford Aerostar (minivan based on the Ranger) never got rust protection beyond what was put on at the factory. Zero issues with rust. However, lots of friends' Toyota pickups from that era had rust problems. Had they used rust protection, would they have avoided that problem? Probably, but most of my friends' vehicles in the area of that era (early 90's ) that did not get rust protection did NOT show rust problems 10 years later. What this says to me is that it is not an issue of taking care of one's investment, it is a case where one group of vehicle REQUIRES more care than another. Not acceptable.

Vik - The manufacturer is sold parts with the understanding that they are within quality limits. If the parts received check good on the incoming inspection the lot is deemed good and accepted. With and ISO type system like the auto industry uses it is even more wide open as so long as the parts manufacturer is supplying the agreed upon QC data the parts are deemed good. Now the end consumer may blame Toyota, however it is not 100% on Toyota is they got faulty parts shipped to them. Alot depends on the integrity of the supplier. Especially if the defect is not something that would be immediately apparent. Note this issue is not affecting ALL Tundras and Tacomas. Also note the trucks it is affecting are almost 10 years old. Do some due diligence and you will find the Big 3 also have corrosion issues in these areas after 10 years. My 11 year old Ranger had a shock mount rot off the frame. Does that mean all Rangers have issues with rotting shock mounts?

The axles Nissan is using are shipped fully to them fully assembled. Just add gear lube. The internals are not available separately. Explain how Nissan is to determine with an incoming inspection that the spider gears in a preassembled axle are faulty? The failures were sporadic basically having no trend. Depending on QC controls at Dana there may have been no way to track a bad lot of gears.

In closing a buyer may blame the finished vehicle manufacturer, but the true source of the problem and the party ultimately responsible is the parts supplier.

Vik - in your post to Ric17 you make mention of domestic vehicles in the early 90's not having issues with rust or requiring any extra care. Then please explain to me why almost every GM, Ford and Dodge truck from the 80's through mid 90's almost always has horrific rot on the fenders and kick panels. Are we to assume you never washed the undercarriage of your van? Are you assuming there was no extra factory protection applied standard due to your location. For awhile in New England Rusty Jones or Ziebart rust protection was almost standard equipment. You needed to request a vehicle to not have it applied. It was done and included n the predelivery prep. New England does nt skimp on the salt either and there are plnety of Toyotas running around without collapsed and perforated frames I assure you. I will guarantee there are more 17 year old Tacomas than Aerostars still on the road here. I haven't seen an Aerostar in YEARS.

@Keith if you haveint seen a aerostar in years, you are blind. ive seen2001 ventures rust(from gm), but you know what toyots rusted more, toyotas are unsafe because there small. toyotas were never really good. I will never forget the day, I wish I still had the truck is was a 1999 F-150 4.2LV6 307,988+kms sold a Jag 340 snowmobile to a rundra owner, in a Tim Hortans parking lots, we backed the beds, he had the useless 4 ' box, and i dented his tail gate real good, with mine, that had about a million dings in it.truth is rust forms because moisture is trapped, when the frames are stored, before the customer sees them, but toyota trucks really are just so lame.

I sell Scrap metal, and some of the crap is old, metal, and i think how pointless it is to crush good trucks, to makes crappier cars/trucks like toyota, we dont need you in North America.

Keith- Toyota is ultimatley responsible. Japanese auto manufactures would watch a supplier for almost a year to make sure the quility was good, before the supplier was issued a contract. That was in the 80's. Now its all about the money. Toyota found a supplier that would do the work for the price they want. The supplier cut corners to make a profit due to lowball price set by toyota. I keep hearing about how toyota stands behind there product because they bought back the tacomas that rusted out and some tundras. Basicly totoya paid those people to keep there mouth shut and got free advertisement on how great they are for doing the right thing. If they did the right, they would have issued a recall and accepted responsiblity. Toyota built the tundra base on their name. The tundra is underdevloped, uncapable, ugly P.O.S!! Nissian titan to!

comment from user on Tundra Headquarters, November 20th, 2009:

We picked up our Tundra from the dealership today after it was there for 76 days. They agreed to replace our frame in early Sept, yet made it clear we were not to badmouth Toyota. We were interviewed by Fox news and a Boston News Channel about the rust problem. The dealership treated us so poorly during this lengthy drawn out situation. They demanded we pay them approx $1700.00 (up front) for parts connected to the frame(also corroded). Weeks went by and my husband kept calling for updates…They would say things like “We don’t care” or “I don’t know what part we need”…it was a nightmare. Today, they called and said it was ready. When we got the truck, the spare tire was missing and the back window broken and all taped up with plastic. The employees of the dealership were laughing and pointing through the window. They claimed we brought it to them like that! They completely sabotaged our truck. We drove it for a half of an hour before the check engine light came on! Clearly a retribution against us for being instrumental in public awareness of this serious safety issue!

When I talk about Chevy brakes, tires and the such, I'm obviously talking about trucks that are relatively new. A friend of mine who used to only buy Chevy trucks and babied them like a newborn child, couldn't keep tires on them. He's now so sick of reliability issues (he started the truck the other day he said and nothing but a cloud of blue smoke emerged) he's said he's looking at a new F150.

I had an 03 Trailblazer LTZ and that thing ate brakes like nothing I had seen before. It was also blowing out headlights and tailights all the time.

Keith mentions the old headgasket problem that everybody and their dog knows about since nearly the dawn of time. Yes, Toyota had 3.0 liter V6 heaqgasket problems. OK. Should I go through the grocery list of every domestic engine defect and recall? Come on man. And to compare the power between a 4 or 6 cylinder small truck engine to a gas sucking V8 monster is pretty silly.

All I know is, I can go out and get into my 08 Tundra without a worry of burning oil (a problem another friend of mine had with his 4.8 GMC), not worrying if the truck is going to go through another set of tires well before their time, not worry about whether the headlights are gonna come on or not and not worry about my resale value dropping like a ton of bricks.

My camshaft works great. My tranmission works excellent. I have no rust issues. Whether it is because I rust check the truck or not really doesn't matter to me. I also personally got my flu shot to prevent possibly getting the H1N1. Should I just stroll along and hope I don't get it or actively do something to prevent it? It's the same thing.

Plus, I'm a contractor who does put alot of kilos on their vehilcle. I have 50 k on her now and yes I've just had to replace a set of tires. This is however a few more than the 10 k my friend had on his truck when he had no other option to do so.

I've had nothing but great experiences with all of my Toyota trucks. If others have had the same with their domestics then right on, that's great! I'm not gonna bash you into the ground like others on this site want to do with Toyota.

I might actually go for a drive in my 93 T100 4X4 today. Another vehicle I have no doubt will start and drive without hesitation.

Articles like this apparently turn all of you into experts. I didn't realize that Toyota has now become the worst brand in history until now. You all have certainly sealed the fate of Toyota because you BELIEVE your Ford, Chevy or Dodge truck is the better product. I'm certain most of your opinions are just that, based soley on inexperience of the automobile. No, I'm sorry, you owned three Ford's and that makes it the greatest car in the world? You change your own oil and filter, maybe even your brake pads and now you're a master mechanic? Toyota may have rusty frames, but if you dig deep enough you'd be surprised what other companies have/had the problem as well. Toyota has a ball joint recall on ONE model truck? Big deal. Do you know of a Chevy, Ford, Dodge pickup that doesn't need them replaced by 80,000 miles? Toyota's actually don't, imagine that. Get real and stop making your opinion a company bashing turd of a waste of paragraph. It would be nice to hear from someone who has a clue, who may know the automobile intimately. Perhaps a master technician, other than your neighbor down the street who only buys domestic because it's the "American" thing to do. Buy a car you like, enjoy it as best as possible, but please... quit with the stupid negative comments like you know everything.

It's simple Toyota stands behind there products. I have a Toyota 3.0 v6 Toyota paid for replacing the headgaskets and heads at 312000 km. Unlike my gm v6 that needed an intake gasket replaced at 66000 km and I found out that gm wouldn't help even though it was a huge problem.

Hey guys there is no need for this chat to carry on negative. Toyota makes amazing trucks but you know what so does anyone else and just like everyone else they make mistakes. Yes Toyota is going through a recall but you know what so has every other manufacturer at one time or another. Sales mean jack to me and it should not matter to really anyone drive what you want and be happy with it. A truck is a truck and it does not matter who makes it as long as it gets the job done and does what its supposed to. This is to talk about all trucks if you do not like a certain truck that is fine. Just don't bash people about owning one lol doesn't really prove anything if you ask me. You guys can bash me if you want just wanted to put in my two cents. Personally I purchase a truck that is comfortable for the long hauls, towing and for fun no matter who makes it. Sorry for the lecture I am just a guy trying to put water on the fire so to speak. For you Toyota truck guys hang in there things will work out soon enough and good luck to you. Same goes to all other truck brand owners.

On a side note it is people that cover up the details and people come and go or get fired and if there are people covering things up I hope they get canned.

As I said before I do not mean to lecture I am just trying to calm things down.

Sorry didnt realize there was another truckguy I am the one with the long post I will change my post name.

The picture of the rusty Toyota looks like a picture of a poorly maintained vehicle. A broken spring! Why would you continue to drive around with that problem. Look closely, it's been like that a long time. The tires look worn out.
Sure, the rust looks bad. I've seen rusted out domestic trucks as well. My brother in law did alot of beachcombing with his GM and despite routine pressure washing, it really looked bad after 3 years.
What's the history on the truck in this photo? This picture doesn't mean a thing unless there is a clear history to go along with it.
Despite the "rusty frame" problem, and the "floor mat" problem,Toyota still has the best overall track record in the industry. This indicates that the "Detroit 2.5" have to really work hard at improving what they sell. Ford has done a great job in this area. GM is hit and miss, Dodge or what ever they are now called has the most work to do.
I can come up with all sorts of anecdotal evidence to slag any brand of truck out there. Let the NHSTA finish their investigations and we will see where the chips fall.
Toyota has to be very careful. Some experts are saying they are starting to make the same mistakes that brought GMC to it's knees. I hope that is not the case. To GM's credit, I just read that they are predicting that they will be able to start paying back their government loans 5 years earlier than required. Good for you - GMC.

Just read some of the posts here:

You will see this has nothing to do with maintance. This is a Toyota problem.

A lot of these people have been after Toyota about this for years. Each year the rust gets worst. Why would you put new tires on a truck that has no value?

This brand loyalty business needs to stop.

Show me a 10 year old truck with no frame rust and I'll show you a liar, someone who weekly washes their undercarriage, had their truck treated with a rust preventative or did a restoration. If you live anywhere that uses road salt like they have in New England you know what I am talking about.

Fwiw the truck in the photo was obviously abused. Also fwiw some of you must not see some people launch at a salt water boat launch. People will rinse the boat and trailer yet many forget the back end of the truck even if they dunked it up to the rotors.

Keith, You too are letting your brand loyalty talk and not logic. We are not talking about just some surface rust. This is severe rust that makes the truck unsafe. This is the second rust problem Toyota has had. Tacomas did not have adequate corrosion protection and they disintegrated and collapsed. It has nothing to do with maintenance.

The "floor mat" problem is an acceleration problem.

This has been going on for years and Toyota just did not want to deal with it.

I find it funny or should I say ironic that if one says something against the Detroit 2.5 or in favor of Toyota then it is being brand loyal. I read one post where the guy was refering to Toyota fans as "religious cultists". I'm not a fan of Toyota or any manufacturer. I'll make my purchase decisions on a case by case basis.
The picture in the post did show signs of poor maintenance - worn tires and a broken spring. What was the this truck's history? A picture taken out of context has absolutely no meaning.
I agree that Toyota needs to sort out their problems. Toyota's reputaton has been damaged. Despite these problems, Toyota and Honda still rate at the top of the automotive industry. That is a sad statement to make considering Toyota's rust problem and "floor mat" problem.
Take a long, hard look at the "domestic" auto industry. They've made there share of big mistakes.
If I am being brand loyal, why would I say something about Ford's work at improving quality control. I also mentioned GM's plan to start paying off their government debt 5 years earlier than neccessary. The brand bashing is excessively biased. What are your loyalties? I fully agree that the brand loyalty needs to stop. Start cleaning up your own house before you point fingers at mine!

@ stuck with lemons - thanks for the link. There are 2 separate, and distinct problems that Toyota needs to deal with in relation to accelleration: 1. stuck floor mats, 2. accelleration/surging problems. Up until the video link you posted all I've seen is evidence indicating "floor mat" problems. The most famous being the MVC in California. See links:
The frame rust problem is another major problem. My arguement in relation to that photo does not change - one photo in isolation does not prove anything. There were signs of poor maintenance in that photo.
Like I have said before: despite Toyota's problems with rusty frames, floor mats and/or accelleration problems - they still rate at the top of the industry for quality and reliability. Ford is on par with the Japanese withy most of their products. GM is hit and miss, and Dodge has the most work to do. That is not brand loyalty. That is the evidence that is out there in the automotive media.

Oh how the mighty have fallen. I have heard people praise Toyota since the 80's because they are the absolute greatest, and how could I possibly prefer my Chrysler products over the last forever quality that Toyota sells. Well.. A few people comment that that kind of rust is just from not maintaining and neglecting them. My 1994 Dakota has over 200K hard neglected miles, it came from the north east, has been to the midwest winters.. and spends time around beach air. Yet has little surface rust on the frame, and no cosmetic rust.
The US company that provides them the frames.. Keep in mind, they are building them to Toyota's specifications.
I'm not saying that Dodge has not made some mistakes in the past; but when Dodge does do something wrong, the media rushes it to every ones attention. People are finally seeing Toyota in the light. Rust, cams, floor mats, surging issues.

The picture shows the owner did not give a dam about their truck and then the media obsessed with bullcrap starts rumor mills and then it spins out of control as with the floor mat issue THAT IS CLEARLY DRIVER ERROR, not the fault of anybody but the morons who drive on the roads today!

I have owned many Toyota's in the upper Midwest, 86 4x4, 86 2wd, 85 2wd, 97 2wd, 05 Tacoma 2wd and not one rust problem like the article suggests.

I have seen ALL MAKES rusted out, let me repeat ALL MAKES rusted out so this is not isolated to Toyota. I think it is a clear indication of owner misconduct where they do not take care of their ride. In the winter you routinly wash your underside when the temps get back up to above freezing or you risk corrosion.

I wouldn't be suprised if the big 3 were behind this media story to dis-credit Toyota and re-gain some lost market share! After all the domestic makers minus Ford are the ones teetering with bankruptcy!

Wow !! You Toyota guys sure cant criticism !!!!!!

Yes ,Toyota has major problems,they always did !!! They just slid by because people think the grass is greener on the other side sort of speak... the media always praises them,saying its only floor mats but we know better,its more than the so called floor mats..another lie from Toyota..


You said Toyota only has 1 ball joint recall...keep drinking the cool-aid brother !!!! You shouldnt bash Domestic trucks,if you cant keep your facts straight !!

Tacoma,4-runner,Tundra,Sequoia ball joints were recalled in 2005 again 2007 !! And thats just the time when I worked with Toyota !!!

Why do you think Toyota is the only truck that doesnt need ball joints after 80,000 miles ? Dodge/Ford/Chevy/Nissan can go past 80,000 without ball joint changes,just because your Toyota made it 81,000 miles before your ball joints broke doesnt mean the others fail at 80,000...You are clueless...You would be shocked to see the numerous major repairs new Toyota's need..absolutely shocked !!!!

I now work at a Dodge dealer and the only Dodge trucks with bad ball joints are high mileage or if it had lower miles it was a truck that was abused!! eg: bent rims from curb jumping,driving with overloaded heavy loads on pot hole filled streets or off road can usually tell the trucks that are going to be problematic,bent bumpers,bent panels,very dirty inside/out,not just mud,salt but built up for many years...

By the way I owned a 2006.5 Toyota Tundra when I worked at Toyota and the engine was knocking (bottom end rod knock)when cold @3,500 miles..I am a mechanic, I know what the problem is/was Toyota refused to fix it..Now work for Dodge quickly tradded the Toyota in for a 2007 Dodge Ram 1500 Hemi now with 60,000 miles and I floor my truck multiple times daily and the engine /trans/ball joints are just like new !!!! No knocking/ticking/squeaks ever !!!

Just finished a trip to Maine. Peeked under about 15 late model Tundras. No one looked like the one in that picture. In fact not one had any excessive rust.

Funny how we have people rushing to defend the domestic supplier who sold Toyota defective frames and trying to push it off on Toyota. Yeah, I am sure the plant was skipping out on rust preventative to cut corners because Toyota was being cheap. That makes a whole lot of sense. Guess what happens when this gets sorted out and it turns out the frame manufacturer was cutting corners? Is being sued and rifled through by the feds worth skimping?

To the person who stated the manufacturer was building them to Toyota's specifications, please explain why then, all of the frames in the rust belt are not having this issue? Did the manufacturer accidentally put the right protection on most of them?

BTW Dodge has had serious ball joint issues. Durango, Dakota and Ram. My FIL's 94 2500 Ram went through 4 sets in 10 years. 3 Dakota owners at work have had theirs replaced at around 50k miles also. BTW the Toyota recalls? Also a US supplier. Are we seeing a trend here yet on why many of the Big 3 vehicles are getting their suppliers from out of the country?

oxi - you are just as extremely brand loyal as many of the GM, Dodge, and Ford guys out there. You just can't seem to see another point of view. You do a grave disservice to your favorite brand by being extremely pro-Toyota. You feed right into the anti - Toyota guys points of view.
Here is an excerpt from what a "Dodge" guy said about Toyota guys:"I wouldn't buy a Toyota just because of the religion ignorant buyers have turned their unshakable faith in Toyota into.""Toyota sold the ignorant buyers that they = quality and thanks to a Japanese lapdog media, people are willing to spend far more for something that is all marketing."
He does a grave disservice to Dodge fans out there just like you do a grave disservice to Toyota fans.
I'll deliberately argue an opposing point of view to dispute/refute poor logic, but if some-one provides me with credible evidence, or a rational counter point, I have no problem accepting that. You, my friend, should try to keep an open mind.

Lou, how am I dis-crediting? The reason I still buy Toyota's because they are great trucks!

I do not take crap from teenagers on this forum with their redneck pickup stories of how bad-a$$ they think their trucks are!

I actually raced down in the Baja races with my 86 pickup after I went mudding locally with a club for many years. And now I take my X-Runner on some of the fastest road courses in the world and pull lateral grip numbers in the corners where all other sport pickups would lose control and crash into the wall!

Lou, I do not make up stories like most on here, I speak from experiance and I push the pickups I have owned to the limits competing in the toughest off-road races in the world with one and to the extremes on the road courses!

Sure I do not pull massive trailers or haul heavy payloads but I can tell the stress and pressure I place on my X-Runner at a typical road course exceeds what pulling and hauling would ever do!

And I do not want to get into the Baja off-road races and what those define of the strength of your pickup!

I am planning to build another off-roader as a bug-out-vehicle and my choice once again will be a Toyota pickup compact/mid-size class... sorry the Dakota, Ranger or Colorado just do not cut it when building an off-roader and mounting 33 or 35 inch tires for maximum ground clearance with a budget to work with now doesn't it?

You need to open your mind bud!

oxi- Thanks for the redneck pickup stories of how bad-a$$ you think your truck is.

oxi - blaming the media or the "big 3" for negative press against Toyota is paranoia at it's finest. Your rant " I am the media" in another post is disconcerting as well. You probably enjoyed the new Ram commercial - "! am Oxi , and my tank is full of ego". Impressive race resume, It must be hard fitting a full faced race helmet over that swollen cranium of yours. In your experience, you like the Toyota - good for you. In your experience you could save a car from crashing if the floor mat stuck - good for you, In your experience you've race Baja - good for you. Your extreme point of view makes Toyota look bad. It even makes what the weird "Dodge" guy said seem plausible. If your on a budjet building a race truck - why don't you just buy a Raptor;)


A Raptor? Too big and heavy for my needs, I do not require a V8 for daily needs and all you need is a well built off-roader and a 4-cylinder engine would be fine!

By the way I ran with an open faced helmet, kind of like Ivan Stewart, no gloves either, he even autographed my truck before a Parker 400 race!

Baja racing is not redneck, they are serious off-roaders competing in the toughest off-road races in the world, ever been to one? After you have been to one or actually have the guts to compete in one, then maybe you can comment on how durable a pickup is!!!

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