Way to go with the Fiesta interior lol

@Tom with a ranger, if you would read the article you would see that it is fords interior, no Ram's.....just saying and I always hated these vans

The Ducato looks dated next to the new Transit. It looks like something straight out of 1999.

Great idea Dodge!

Hmmm, I wonder if that dash is Ford's production ready version. The covering looks sort of floppy. Dashgate, take two!

"The prototype we photographed is sporting the classic Ram crosshair grille affixed to an otherwise unmodified Fiat Ducato van, suggesting that the Chrysler Group will likely do little else to tailor the European courier van to the U.S. market."

More badge engineering from Ram.

The Ducato looks like DOOKIE just like the Transit. That leaves GM with the only NORMAL LOOKING full size van. Aother WIN for GM in my book and another LOSS for Ford and Fiat/Chrysler.

These new vans are so dam ugly. I drive a E250 now for work.
Hope I don't have to drive this or the Ford Transit. I would prefer to drive the G.M.C. Savana. I will pray.

The next generation of Ram 2500 and Chassis Cabs appear now to be scheduled for a January 2013 launch, with the Ram 3500 following in February or March. These are expected to carry forward the Ram 1500′s aerodynamic improvements and, most likely, its method of slashing parasitic losses (including wind drag) to raise mileage. While there has been no word of whether a stop-start system or active shutters will be included, sources appear to be certain that the Rams will have a standard or optional 6.4 liter V8 engine, with and without MDS depending on the model and transmission, to get the base price down.
Give me the 6.4L Hemi in my new Power Wagon.

I've been seeing a pair of Ducatos running around near my house since the spring- usually stopping for some Clown snacks at 6am. I'm very curious to see what they use for a transmission- there's not an 8000# plus automatic transaxle on the shelf that I can think of. Must be a ZF 8HP of some kind. My Jeep-Truck friend is being mum about it. He did slip that the Cummins will get a big bad Aisin trans, including hig- torque engines.
Hemi V8- I fail to see what most of your post has to do with the new vans.

wow, am I a hypocrite.

@HemiV8-what do you do all day st work? Sit and admire the stylings of your shop van? This vans replace pickups, SUV,s, and light duty commercial trucks in the rest of the world. No comments on the fact that the Ducato will most likey show upvin NA with nothing changed other than Ram grill?
@Michigan Nob- Cheering for outdated products is something you must have to get accustomed to as a GMC fan.

Bob....no one cares about your "book" I dont care for the styling of these euro vans. The sprinter was ok.....better looking in my opinion than this.

Hemi V8 - Last I heard you weren't working but why does it really matter what a work van looks like it is better in every other way? When it comes down to it, they are all ugly because they are work vans. Don't like being told what to do, work for youself. You work for somebody else and you are just working to make them rich. Or get another job where you use your mind instead of driving a van. Everybody makes choices. What new choices can you make in your life that can better server you and your family?

Some of the drawings on allpar with the Ram grille look pretty good. I would buy one if the Transit wasn't available.

Ah ok that is Ford's interior lol whoops.

Still, why use such a car like interior in a work van? Shouldn't it be function over form in this application? I guess europeans demand a plush sophisticated interior even in a plumbers van lol

Back to the topic of the new Ram van, it is disappointing to see simple rebadging. Would it have killed them to at least swap out lights to something that better matches the Ram look? Or is this the future Ram look? lol

Yeah, I know they are meant for work, but there HAS to be a way to make them less ugly!

Why not paste the front clip from a Peterbuilt to the rest of the van body? I for one wouldn't mind being seen in a (mini)-Big Rig...

Bob,

Are outdated trucks and vans the new normal at GM?

Ford, America's commercial van leader, will offer both vans. The new Transit and the E-series. GM loses again.

@jason, Yes it does have some advantages. You can stand up inside to get to the part shelves. Better on my back. The problem is it's to tall for working in big city parking structures.

Sure is ugly. Must be other reasons why it is the #1 selling vans in europe.

Looks like the Ducato is front wheel drive? That's just a twist beam axle in the back.

Ug Ug Beauty only a mother would love. Which one is the mother? Oh no there sisters. Where's the Aztec when it is so badly needed.

Here is a Ducato RV we have in Australia. They look pretty good.

http://www.trakka.com.au/tway850.htm

The Fiat site we have for the Ducato gives you a good indication on what ot expect. They can be made as flatbeds also.

http://www.fiat.com.au/ducato?gclid=CIjC6I2lpLICFZBUpgodJ0MA9Q

Hemi - These Transits and Sprinter vans are a creature of beauty to be seen, not hidden. Park it in front of the McDonalds/Burger king/Wendy's/Chick Fillet and walk in to buy your food. Park it on the street. Park it in an open lot. Park it in front of your house. Let your Sprinter be eye candy for others while you're leisurely enjoying your meal. (Be sure to carry a rag to wipe of the droolings left by admirers).

Your employer bought (or will buy) a high top van for its spaciousness which gives you lots of freedom to walk around on the inside. You'll lose that freedom if you become a conformist and buy something else, so you can conveniently park under all those tons and tons of propped up concrete. So what if most parking lots cannot accomodate this work of art. That's their loss. As you know many standard full-size vans half ton pickups cannot fit in parking structures either.

Are you going to let that hinder you from acquiring one of the best all-round vans ever invented by man? Transits and Sprinters are considerate vehicles. They give you some inconveniences that force you to walk. Walking keeps you healthy, so you can enjoy your van for a very long time. I challenge you to find another vehicle where you can install two tread mills, in which you and the wife can exercise in the dead of winter, while standing.....upright.

The FIAT "Born to be a Motorhome" Video for the Ducato. The Ducato is less of a General Van , than a small Class C
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXF5SmylexM

Motorhome basis. Hugely popular in Europe for that reason, outsells the Sprinter as a Motorhome base. Not that well known as a Van here compared to its IVECO cousin.

Just as strange looking as the Transit. As I've said before, I'm really going to have to get used to these new European van styles. I'm just not feeling them yet.

I very much agree that these new fans are not growing on me ! The best comprise I have seen thus far is the new Nissan van .Looks like a hybrid of a N/A and European looking van .But still if was to buy a new van and had un-limited funds it would be a One ton GM duramax.

They're not new styles. They have been here in the US since 2001. They are everywhere. Ram doesn't even sell a large full-size van anymore and wants to get back into the business.

Wow, these euro type vans are garbage...they will never EVER hold up like the vans currently offered

@hr206- yes- the Ducato is the one offering in the Full-size vans that comes fwd only. For regular van work, thats not so bad though- you can make a beam axle hold as much as drive axle. The floor is lower. Unloaded traction is better. Loaded traction is still good. The transaxle has to be really beefy. Until recently (Iveco commercial vehicles is now seperate fom Fiat), applications that required RWD from Fiat were served by the simillar sized but heavier duty Iveco Daily.
Hemi V8- both the Transit and Ducato can be had in a "std. roof version, which is the same height as an E350. Most service vans I see aren't parked in structures though, but rather at the service door 'round back.

@Evan K
Your view and some of your bretheren has occured in the past. When the auto was in its infancy there were people just like you

They made people walk in front of vehicles with lanterns. They even made claims that any speed over 15mph would cause medical disorders.

Really how can you justify your argument, you just made yourself look like you have a medical disorder.

Explain to this forum why you think they aren't reliable. I bet you can't other than some baseless rant.

What do you fear? Progress?

@ Dave,

@Tom With a Ranger ,

This Ford Transit is NOT new...this is a old 1990's van from Europe..it is the same as the European Transit !!!!!!!

Also,you say GM is stuck behind with design..WHAT ! The Econoline was around with the same body since 1992 !! GM's Vans since 1996 ! Furthermore,Ford's F-250-350 were around with the same body since 1997 (sold as 1998's) and the F-150 is the same since 2004 ! (As GM is only a few models years old) Seems to me Ford is the one stuck with old designs,they cant even come up with new versions for themselves,European old Transit,Turkish Transit Connect,Volvo based Taurus,European Festiva,Focus..WHERE are the American Ford's ? They are gone and we have old retread European Ford's ..

@ Big Al from Oz ,

The reason we dont like these vans are because they are extremely ugly for us ! We are not used to these odd looking vans,with tall narrow weird looking styling,odd interiors,we had the Sprinter for a decade or longer and still its an eyesore..Put a old Dodge Van,Ford,GM beside one of these Euro vans and the American vans look very nice.We even used to customize these things and were more popular than trucks back in the in the 70's and 80's and you still can buy van conversions (travel van or Camper van)

Our vans actually had some performance behind them as well,V-8's that perform like a pick up or better because in some cases the vans are a little lighter than the pick ups,(empty cargo vans).FYI.My old man had a 1985 Dodge Ram B-350 with a 5.9 (360 4bbl) 3.54 gears and would run low 15's in thew 1/4 bone stock,later it was my van for work with a carb change ,exhaust it ran 14.80's ! Even his newer late 90's Dodges would burn rubber with the 360 and 4.10's it felt just as quick as our 2002 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.7 V-8 (15 flat 1/4 mile,7.0 0-60)but never tried the newer ones as in the 80's I was still a 20 year old at home and took my old mans van to Friday night drags because the darn thing felt quick !

I would say even current American Vans look better than any European van,and the driving position/feel is what we are used to,the Euro Vans (i drove them) are awkward,uncomfortable and the Euro Vans just have no go in them !! Current American vans pretty much feel/perform like our Pick Up trucks while the Euro vans feel wobbly and like your going to fall out of them.

http://www.explorervan.com/

http://www.classicvans.com/camper-vans

http://www.hightopconversionvans.com/

@RJ - most people do not see it that way, sales do not see it that way, profit margins do not see it that way.
Can you come up with anything factual to say? Please post all of the engineering and/or empirical evidence that backs your claims?
Evolution versus revolution.
That is what sells vehicles to traditionally conservative pickup truck buyers.
GMC hasn't done much of anything to evolve or improve their current trucks. That is why everyone feels they are dated. The basic design style is newer than the Ford's evolved style.
Your rants are just that - rants.
Thank you for keeping Chevy #2.
It won't be too long and they'll be #3 if the next gen is a weak design. If it is based off of the currect generation, that will equate to a weak design as many feel it was a weak design to begin with.
Read the posts, some of the most agressive anti-Chevy guys on this site are former Chevy owners.

@Diesel
I know what you're say about performance, everyone likes performance. NA market isn't the only vehicle market changing. We have similar problems here with our V8 cars, but not with commercial vehicles. Australia has only 22 millon people and yet we are the 7th largest consumer of oil in the world.

I don't know if you have been reading my comments but the US can't keep on going the way it's going with your vehicles. You just can't afford it anymore. The Europeans taxed fuel to change habits and the US is trying to regulate change.

So the outcome is in Europe there is less regulation on what you drive so long as you can afford it and in the US it will be more what the government wants you to drive. Which is the more socialist approach.

I saw an interesting article yesterday that commented on the fact that Saudi Arabia will probably start to import oil by 2030. It's all well and good to want certain levels of performance but it has to sustainable.

Another reality is most Americans drive 4 and 6 cylinder cars, just like us. So this need for massive power in commercial vehicles is really to satisfy a minority.

15 second 1/4 miles is stuff for teenagers, buy a performance vehicle for that not a work truck.

On the looks of them, they need to be aerodynamic to improve fuel consumption. We haven't had vans that looked like yours since the early 80s.

Finally, the US is modernising and improving the efficiency of its commercial vehicle fleet.

Hopefully you will start to import less oil so you can be less indebted to the world.

@Diesel
Show vans were popular here once.

http://www.buga.com.au/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=2&topic=3327.0

RJ, It's the new Transit. The name has been around but it has been redesigned for next year. Transit Connect is also redesigned and was Ford's oldest Europeon design and in the US, it was only superceeded by the E-series.

The Eseries is on it's way out after 2014.

SuperDuty redesigned many times since it began. Only the cab structure is the same.

F-150 all new floor pan in 09, over 2000 new parts, new safety cage, 6' longer crewcab, redesigned lighter frame and longer suspension, new 6 speed transmission, new wheels, all body panels changed, new brakes in '10, new steps, new glass Raptor, new interiors, all new engines in 11, etc. What else is left? Yep, it is the same truck as 04.

@Dave - but it looks like all they did was change the grill ;)

Ram Full size van will get new front wheel drive?

Geez... When will (some) people here realize that buyers in this segment don't care about styling. Function, utility, reliability, cost of operation and purchase price are what customers are interested in; not styling.

Having a job as an electrician, when my company switched from Econolines to Sprinters. It was night and day in how much better the Sprinter was. I'm 6 ft tall and I can stand up straight in the back of my van now. Never could have done that in the Econoline. Can't wait to see the Transit.

Great Dodge. More companies are launching the Vans.

Ford Transit & Transit Connect
Nissan NV1500 & NV200

Now Ram Ducato, surely Van will become a big segment as they offer lot of volumetric space as you can use them as passenger vehicle, freight vehicle, recreational vehicle, etc.

15 years ago when Toyota launched RAV4 as CUV, it was a small segment, but today CUVs command nearly 23% of the overall market share.

I guess they also offer a CNG (Natgas) version since there is lot of space inside and the CNG costs less than 1/2 as much as gasolene / diesel.

I have to agree with all that has spoken in terms of the RAM'S exterior design, it looks unfinished from the Front - End and all of the plastic just adds more fuel to the fire, it's been since 1994/1995 that the Dodge Full Sized Van has been on the scene and this is a disapointing way for a comeback based on design. We'll just have to see what RAM can do to make up for that with it's overall performance in the coming months, I've Googled the 2014 F-150 and it shows a finished version of Fords new Van within the group of photos, it certainly looks better in all aspects.

This is a real van:

http://www.uk-tuning.com/catalog/info_648.html

You goofy GM guys are hilarious !! You think Bammy's gonna spare your Express and Samantha Vans ? Think again ! They're gonna be replaced by this Opel beauty queen: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6c/Opel_Movano_B_front_20100705.jpg

Hah-ha ah-hah-ha!!!!

Apart from a few asthetic changes the UK model (branded Fiat Professional) should be the same

http://www.fiatprofessional.co.uk/uk/Models/Ducato_Passenger_Transport

I am so glad that the big 3 are finally coming to their senses and going by way of Eurovan design (that has been more than successful for decades.) I thought that the last Dodge full size van sucked! It was fugly, the front seats/area was a joke, too small and extremely uncomfortable (I know, I drove one for a few years and had a fleet of them). We missed our Astro vans the most, but the full sized Express/Savana's were nice, big but dang, they kept overheating (Arizona will put most cooling systems to the test) and of course, GM always said, "Could not duplicate or No trouble found". Total crap! That's why I will never get a GM van. Although I do like the one from Australia. I really liked the Sprinter when it hit our shores. So it's nice to see Dodge partnering up for the Ducato. I can't wait to see the new Ford Transit, which will be another cool, tested, EuroVan.

Nice practical, working box -- needs real bumpers .