Spied: 2018 Ram 2500/3500
Although we understand there are not major changes coming anytime soon, Ram is likely to be squeezing every bit of torque out of the current Cummins straight-six-cylinder engine. Here's what our spy shooters sent us after a productive tour in the Rocky Mountains.
"We caught a disguised Ram 2500 heavy-duty test truck, along with others, undergoing elevation testing, suggesting that diesel engine upgrades are in the works.
"We were able to closely inspect this this Ram test truck and got a good look at a bulging hood addition grafted onto the front of the truck, which was covered by a camouflaging bra. The hood add-on is interesting, since GM's recently updated HD pickups showcase a ram-air hood scoop that feeds as much as 60 percent of the cooling air to their trucks' Duramax engine. We were left to wonder, are future Ram HD trucks testing a similar air-intake strategy?
"It's clear that the bulge is something that is attached to the test Ram's hood, and not smoothly sculpted in. We've inspected the hood bulge by hand and, by all accounts, the feel and appearance of this hood seems to be a housing for an air scoop. When the truck is driving at speed, we witnessed the camouflage puff up, as some air manages to get underneath the camouflage. However, if it's a functional air inlet, the camouflage makes no special provision to allow unobstructed air into the hood-mounted add-on. GM had tested its ram-air hood scoops for years before they went to production, and their camouflage always had an opening to let air pass through. That may be a strike against the case for a new ram-air-enhanced design, but testing temperatures were notably cool on this day, so it's possible a slit in the hood camo wasn't necessary.
"As the Truck Wars continue to rage among the Detroit Three, with Ford announcing that the 6.7-liter Power Stroke diesel in its 2017 Super Duty will generate 440 horsepower and a segment-leading 925 pounds-feet of torque. Ram engineers are clearly working to keep pace, and whatever they're working on was contained under the camouflaged hood of this 2500 test truck.
"We should note that after we photographed this 2500, we later saw that it had been joined by a phalanx of similarly disguised Ram HD models of every stripe, towing heavy trailers up some of the mega-mountain grades. Ram is not standing still."
KGP Photography images
Comments
Why bother putting the bra on, looks like the grille and head lights still look the same as the current model.
We saw the same vehicles while coming back from elk hunting. As you can see, the large grill is really not necessary as they were cruising up Loveland Pass with the camo'd bra on blocking off probably a 3rd of the air that could be going through the front grill to cool the engine.
The 3/4 and 1 ton trucks have larger grills then semi's that pull a lot more with larger motors, I just don't get it...
Hood scoops for everyone!!! The HD Diesel Segment is going to pull EVERY trick in the book. So who's gonna be first to 1000lb torque? Whos got a tranny that handle it? (maybe GM? maybe not?). How about 1st with an electronically controlled 2 speed rear? That would be mind blowing... We are going to see a lot of HD segment best in class games... just keep the consoles in and bumpers on please.
GM has published HP and TQ for the new L5P 445hp @2800 rpms and 910 ft lb at 1600...
There is a black box hanging down in front of the right side duel wheels?
Gm wont hang with this truck, i doubt Ford will either, the Cummins is too strong for what it is in the segment.
The new 6.7 Cummins was introduced so Ram is following up with the changes that Cummins made. They have to do testing every time Cummins changes something.
https://cumminsengines.com/showcase-item.aspx?id=343&title=B6.7+for+Medium-Duty+Truck+(2017)&Filters=0&Categories=38#overview
"Gm wont hang with this truck, i doubt Ford will either, the Cummins is too strong for what it is in the segment.
Posted by: Nitro | Sep 26, 2016 10:23:02 AM"
Or like very other "segement leading" Cummins, you will only ever see that power output on a test dyno, once its on the road the computer never comes close to allowing full power to the ground, just look at the results from every HD truck comparison run by PUTC in the last 5 years. Nice truck but better get used to being third up the mountain (by several minutes) year after year after year.
I would be surprised to see Cummins approve more torque out of that 6.7L. It is already maxed in HP. To get over 900lbft of torque in a Cummins you have to go to the ISL9. In order to get the current 900lbft of torque in the Cummins it has to be on the $12K diesel option in a 3500 dually only and you only get that torque in 4th,5th,and 6th gears. That is their way of keeping the engine and trans alive. The Duramax can make more torque but it is harder due to its design. But it can easily make more HP. The 6.7L powerstroke can produce even more torque but eventually HP will be limited by its design. GM needs a complete new transmission for the upgraded power and Fords 6R140 is already built for more power. The power wars will stop. And in the end GM and Ford will be equal with fiat in the rear.
As much as I love the Super Duty any honest person will say that at the end on the day the Cummins is the most reliable engine. They are cheap to maintain and less moving parts to break.
You mean "fewer moving parts." I have had diesel mechanics tell me the Duramax is the least expensive to repair and maintain. I suppose it depends on what needs replacing.
I don't think there is a such thing as "maxed out" in turbo engines. The problem is perhaps to have a good balance in terms of durability, fuel economy, turbo lag, flat torque curve and other details.
Would tend to think that RAM is #2 in HD's? No surprise considering that the RAM 3500 tows like +5.000 lbs more than GM 3500's.
looks to me that the front of the truck is a few inches shorter
if the spy camera man can get a close up picture of the interior he should have a tape rule to make some quick measurements of the truck
I work on OTR trucks for a living. I asked a Cummins guy at at truck show once how much torque they could get out of their engines. His reply was that they were limited by what the Dodge could handle. I do see an end to these Hp torque wars. If Ram figures out a way to shoehorn the ISC into their trucks, it game, set, match.
Meanwhile the war between HD diesel power plants is on!;
http://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/autos-trucks/gm-scoops-itself-with-l5p-duramax-output-%E2%80%93-445-hp-910-lb-ft/ar-BBwAGWE?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartandhp
Gm news 6.6 duramax 445hp,,910fp ,,,,for now,,,
Nice looking trucks, to bad Ford can't build a great looking HD like Ram and GM do.
Chevys biggest problem
1 body above a very low frame
2 def can even on 4x4 located below body behind passenger wheel well
3 independent suspension "to many moving parts
Just my 2 pence
That first picture is telling for numbskulls not knowing to setup a trailer for towing.
Don't know why everyone has to come here to CO. and run their crap up and down the I-70 corridor to test it....crowded enough already....so Fiat take your stuff and go back to Michigan with Boob...I mean Bob.....
I don't think there is a such thing as "maxed out" in turbo engines. The problem is perhaps to have a good balance in terms of durability, fuel economy, turbo lag, flat torque curve and other details.
Posted by: George | Sep 26, 2016 3:59:33 PM
That pretty much is the meaning of maxed out. If you compromise durability, emmisions compliance, poor drivability you pretty much max out the usefullness of the engine.
. I asked a Cummins guy at at truck show once how much torque they could get out of their engines. His reply was that they were limited by what the Dodge could handle. I do see an end to these Hp torque wars. If Ram figures out a way to shoehorn the ISC into their trucks, it game, set, match.
Posted by: Hdtrktch | Sep 26, 2016 5:22:09 PM
If that is the case then all of the bigger engines would not be needed. They could just use the ISB.
Well, Chuck Z, they come out there to test on the biggest hill in the country. If it works there, it'll work everywhere. We have a few decent grades here in MI, but nothing where you can run a truck at WOT for 10 minutes. Same goes for going back down.
That hood scoop may be not so much to bring air into the engine, but rather to let air out and aid cooling. For whatever reason, today's engines tend to get MUCH warmer than they used to.
That hood scoop may be not so much to bring air into the engine, but rather to let air out and aid cooling. For whatever reason, today's engines tend to get MUCH warmer than they used to.
Posted by: Road Whale | Sep 27, 2016 12:32:19 PM
It is due to performance and emissions. Hotter engine will operate at a greater efficiency. Down side is you need to control it. Most GM vehicles I have driven operate at 210F. Higher than what most people think is normal. But design calls for that and they can maintain that temp. With big power comes big heat. It must be expelled efficiently to maintain proper temp. Even transmissions operate over 200F now. Pretty much the norm.
We bought our Chevy Silverado in 2004 (just about brand new). Now it has about 99,000 miles and barely anything has gone wrong. It is by far the most dependable thing we've ever owned. All we do is beat on this truck and the more we beat on it the more it seems to like it. We've taken it just about anywhere you can take a truck (off road and them some) and have hit some big off road ditches and scraped the bottom and it didn’t harm the vehicle, thanks to the Z71 package with skidplates. The motor is unstoppable. It’s a 5.3 V8 or same as a 327 and it will smoke the tires if you tell it to.
It also has everything to make you happy, including the heated leather seats. It has also hauled more than most 1-ton trucks will and it’s only a half ton truck. The gas mileage is respectable, even when towing. We were also able to haul a tractor, plowing discs, and an ATV all on the same load!!! No problem. And after we were done beating on it for 4 days and putting on 804 miles, it drove like it was brand new! You just can't stop it and it is the best truck I’ve driven and I will always have lots of respect. Basically, it has changed my life. I couldn’t live without it or nothing would ever get done and it’s also my favorite toy!!! And the new ones are even better!!!
I LOVE MY CHEVY TRUCK!!
Just leaked - 2017 Duramax - 445 HP 910 lb-ft of torque!!!
2016 Ram 1500 Hemi. Stopped running Saturday. As of Wed no significant contact from Ram and virtually no contact from Ed Voyles dealership. I'd say they don't know what's wrong except I can't get anyone on the phone. Ram seems to be avoiding me so they don't have to give me a loaner and the Ed Voyles rep must be sitting on the toilet all day because he can't seem to pick up the phone. Thank goodness Georgia has strong lemon law, counting up to 30 then they have to buy it back.
I purchased a used ram 3500 for use on my farm and to pull my camper and haul my sxs back in Feb 2016 with 44,000 miles on it. In July 2016 took a trip to Florida and the check engine light came on. Took in when I returned home they reprogrammed the pcm. hence turned off the light. At the end of July 300 miles later I went to Tenn. The light came on again on my return home. 30 miles from home the traction control 4 wheel drive and anti lock brake lights came on. So I scheduled an appointment for the following Friday. Dropped it off at 8 am the 5th of Aug. They have put 4 or 5 parts on it all have had to be ordered.
They still have the truck 3 going on 4 weeks later and the part they say it now needs is on national back order until the 6th of Sept. I have tried to get my money back as it's holding me up on things I need to do. The dealer says no and Chrysler complaint dept has done nothing but follow up with the dealer occasionally calling me... saying that it doesn't qualify for a buyback. How do you sell vehicles you can keep parts for and how long is too long to have to wait? My patience are done... MY SUGGESTION IS DO NOT BUY A RAM PRODUCT CAUSE THEY DO NOT BACK THEM. Since I work with the public and go above and beyond to keep my customers satisfied, I believe this is very poor customer service.
I purchased a brand new 2011 Ram 2500 and my serviceman at the dealership noticed severe rust spots while doing an oil change last May. I cannot believe a 5 yr old vehicle would have a problem like that. The dealership said it would cost $1,500.00 to replace because they have to lift the motor to change the pan. I wash my truck regularly. I contacted Ram customer care and they said it is out of warranty and it is because I live in the northeast. If Ram is going to design a vehicle where you have to lift the motor to change the pan, how about using a quality steel that will not rust out in 5 yrs.
2013 Dodge Ram 1ton Dually with 50,000 miles blew out all transmission fluid while hauling my horses. Had it towed to dealership. Took 2 weeks to diagnose problem. Hello, lost power. No transmission fluid. I'm no mechanic but even I know, it's the TRANSMISSION! Under warranty but they only want to rebuild transmission not replace it. Another 2 weeks goes by, get it, put back together, not running right, still there! This is a truck used for business, nothing I can haul with for over a month!! UNACCEPTABLE! I have called everywhere I know to call! Can someone help? This is my 4th dodge and definitely my last dodge!
I heard from the local Cummins shop here in the southwest that Ram is waiting until everyone makes there numbers official and putting their numbers out. He says it will be making 450 to 475 horsepower and 925 to 975 lb-ft torque, but they are looking for a transmission that can handle the sheer strength the motor will be putting out.
RAM has always struggled to keep a transmission together behind the Cummins. Basically if they could strike a deal with Allison they could very easily stomp any figures Ford or GM can lay on the table. But they stubbornly stay with arguably some of the weakest transmissions in the industry.
They are all very strong engines.
I'm not as concerned as which one makes it to the top of the mountain first as I am as to which one can pass the most fuel stations.
Also when that truck is paid off after 5 years which one still has the most life left in it.
The Cummins is strong in those aspects.
I have a slightly modified 14 Ram 3500. It makes a little over 600 hp and between 1250 and 1300 ft/lb of torque. I can NOT begin to tell you how easily this truck will pull 10,000+# trailer through the mountains with ease. Trust me when I say these current diesels can easily make big numbers. The only thing limiting them now is emissions.
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