Has it been 4 years?
Huh, well I guess that kind of showcases the impact of the Colorado/Canyon.
430,000 units in 4 years? Certainly better than the Ridgeline, but hardly a smashing sales success.
The size is good for us, but the V6 just isn’t.
We got to use a Tacoma and Colorado for a couple back to back weekends, the dealer (a big name here in Phoenix) allowed us to actually try towing with them, thanks in (large part) to the family business buying history.
The take away was that both trucks are well served by their respective V6s, but once a 5,000 lbs trailer is attached, they struggle in mountains.
Perhaps a 5.3 V8 option could make a significant difference?
While the HP difference isn’t massive, the difference in torque is significant at all RPMs.

I really like the Colorado, and if I was in the market for a mid-size right now, that is what I would buy. The Toyota Tacoma seating position (on the floor) is a deal killer for me...otherwise the Colorado/Tacoma are fairly close in my mind. The Colorado needs an interior update, and they need to add the 2.7 as an option. With these upgrades, the Colorado may be able to fend off the new Ranger, and keep it's number two sales position.

If only GM could fix the airbags going off while driving off-road.

Just when Ford finally gets around to releasing their Ranger, this happens. Sorry Ford, you snooze you lose.

GM wins again!

GM wins again!

Somebody is using my name! It is disrespectful to use someone's name that is not yours. I demand respect!

Hahaha. Ford fangirls lose again.

@James

You make some good points. Unless there's a real change in the climate with Toyota, and the Big 3, you can forget the V8 option in the midsize space.

The automakers really make big profits on the half ton trucks and they'd love to sell you one to pull that 5,0000 trailer in the mountains. Under 5k is a suitable target for the midsize V6s, but higher than that and they want to put you in a half ton.

And of course GM also offers the diesel option in their midsizers so anybody who really needs some extra torque has that route too. GM is very proud of their diesel option, based on the big up-tick in the MSRP

Somebody is using my name! It is disrespectful to use someone's name that is not yours. I demand respect!

Posted by: TNTGMC THE RESPECTED | Nov 10, 2018 12:05:49 PM

You must earn respect. And you have a long way too go. Your constant anti Ford rhetoric under your multiple usernames is the main reason you have no redirect.

Understand GMRSGREAT/TNTGMC?

papa jim
I would almost agree with the statement or your interpretation of the US pickup market. You have removed the competition from your statement and comparison.

This taints your credibility, sort of like DiM. Papa DiM?

Except you have negated to mention a couple of things. It appears you have had a DiM'esque moment.

First, what about what we receive as global pickups? These should be entered into your argument as they are part of your argument. You just can't place certain biases on your arguments to attempt to gain more credence from you comment, ie, remove global competition when it suits.

Your comment lacks credibility due to your reluctance to make all pickups inclusive, whether global or US.

You only mention US midsizers, which are on par with tractors.

Second, what about FE? Well, as I've mentioned to many, US policy makes alternative diesel energy less viable and competitive with gasoline. We have pickups that already get 40mpg on the highway, with all of the bling that you hold so close to your heart. I do think our pickup truck and even commercial vehicle fleet FE average is better than the US. So, how good is your FE over your 1/2 ton pickup fleet?

Upgrades??? Is this like eating at Micky's, "I want an upgrade" as you pointed out. Why not just make a truck with the best possible engine?? So, a basic pickup in the US comes with a crappy V6 on top of two cement blocks for seats??

Trail Runner package?? What?? If you make a 4x4, why do you need an off road trail package?? In Australia if we had to buy a off road trail package for an off road vehicle the company will go broke. A Raptor isn't the best example of an off roader either.

Outside of the US, an off road package is buying a 4x4 instead of a 2WD.

As you have displayed with your comments and with your ignorance, the US pickup truck is built to a bare minimum, hence all of the upgrading required to make it competitive to a global midsizer.

No wonder you guys don't want to chicken tax removed. That's the way your argument appears papa DiM.

Laying down Knowledge from Automotive Producing Australia.

Wait.

They don't even refine their own Petro down under.

Thank goodness for South East Asia.

Your constant anti Ford rhetoric under your multiple usernames is the main reason you have no redirect.

Understand GMRSGREAT/TNTGMC?
Posted by: papajim | Nov 10, 2018

posted by the FAKE papajim just moments ahead of a comment from BAFO. Coincidence?

BAFO is a lot like the boorish guy at the cocktail party who just told a very long winded joke and he's the only one laughing.

He used to spar on this comments page with a guy he called DIM. FIVE BLEEPING YEARS AGO.

Which is just like yesterday to a fellow so fixated on making everyone else agree with him.

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Cant even outsell a 10 year old Tacoma

The underpowered overseas engines won't help James. Not sure what BAFO is railing about.

Save money on car batteries. Bring any old battery back to life. Visit https://restorbatterys.blogspot.ca

Posted by: lewis t | Nov 10, 2018 5
/QUOTE

SPAM
and a load of krap that doesnt work,,dead bateries are only good for REcycling,,

The take away was that both trucks are well served by their respective V6s, but once a 5,000 lbs trailer is attached, they struggle in mountains.
Perhaps a 5.3 V8 option could make a significant difference?
While the HP difference isn’t massive, the difference in torque is significant at all RPMs.

Posted by: James

James, you are correct about the V6 gaspot engines struggling up mountain passes , revving to the moon pulling 5k . We have 2 of the Canyon Diesels, they both tow 6500 lbs up the mountains without breaking 2500 rpm, and hold speed with no struggle. The best part is they get 30 mpg average per tank, and 19 mpg while towing, pretty awesome for a 5 thousand lb crew cabling box truck. Both have been very reliable as well, no issues at all on them. If the mid size trucks did not offer the diesel we would have gone with Full size rucks with the V8. We had a 2015 Canyon V6 with the gas V6, it was a good truck for the most part, but it only got 21 mpg average per tank when empty, and towing it struggled in the mountain passes AND sucked fuel bad, 11 mpg towing...yikes.

Trail Runner package?? What?? If you make a 4x4, why do you need an off road trail package?? In Australia if we had to buy a off road trail package for an off road vehicle the company will go broke. A Raptor isn't the best example of an off roader either.

Outside of the US, an off road package is buying a 4x4 instead of a 2WD.

As you have displayed with your comments and with your ignorance, the US pickup truck is built to a bare minimum, hence all of the upgrading required to make it competitive to a global midsizer.

No wonder you guys don't want to chicken tax removed. That's the way your argument appears papa DiM.
Posted by: The Big A | Nov 10
/QUOTE

Good points..too bad many people are stupid to pay more for all those extras,,as the famous saying goes,sucker is born every minutes..
I wouldnt buy CC simply bc they are too overpriced..plus the bed is too tiny..
One can get FULL size 4x4 for the same money

@James
Read any review of Ridgeline and all will say about samething and are favorable. US News World Report Rank #2 mid-sized pickup truck. CAR & Driver Crossover comfort and pickup truck capabilities converge on the best midsized pickup money can buy. Autoblog also
favorable the list goes on.

W-T-F over?

I will always say to many people stuck on that Body On Frame thinking. GM & Toyota had Unibody type pickup trucks as concepts.
They probably would have gone into production but they back pedaled to safety. One even saying they were not going to manufacture unibody and body on frame midsized.
But if they were thinking about it should make you wonder why.

Tower?

W-T-F...over

My father-in-law used to have a Ridgeline, worked well for him...they never towed anything, didn't carry heavy loads etc. Personally, since I tow regularly (above Ridgeline's towing capacity anyway) and sometimes carry heavy loads, a unibody pickup would not be for me.

If the US market ever sees a compact pickup again (and I hope it will), my guess is that it would be a unibody model.

I wish they'd put a 6.2 in it so it could beat the Ranger. I think....

Epic failure this is, cannot make better sales, introduce another model that will cost more and more for GM!

What does GM have to worry, they will get another illegal bailout and ignore our laws to get away with these failures!

Tacoma wins again!

@Oxi
Tacoma with it's great ground clearance for off-road is not a great vehicle for elderly people.
It's ingress/egress would be challenged for elderly or person with mobility issue. My 91 year old mother couldn't get into Tacoma and seating is uncomfortable. I use the plastic folding step stool for her to get into the Ridgeline even with side steps. The 2nd generation is even better.

The Ridgeline also offers more spacious cabin for midsized truck.
Compare to Colorado/Canyon also Tacoma.
The Ridgeline has the 60/40 split fold-up rear seat that offers pretty much a flat floor for storage. With seats down in seating position you have great amount of storage space underneath them.
This is like if carring a golf bag or duffel type luggage.
This was a feature on 1st genration Ridgeline but 2nd generation seats fold up higher so more space. Rear seating is more comfortable then other midsized trucks.

If I were getting a traditional body on frame pickup truck I would get Canyon over Colorado. The Canyon is slightly more luxurious then Colorado and offers some features not on Colorado. Features like heated steering wheel that I thought was useless feature. I tried it out on the Black Edition Ridgeline at Auto Show that was powered-up and just a wonderful feature to have. Some Lexus vehicles had it but they didn't heat all around like Ridgeline. It's standard on RTL-E and Black Edition Ridgeline and accessory on other models.
NIce features like that more refinement is what I want over towing or offroad ability.

The Ridgeline also offers more spacious cabin for midsized truck.
Compare to Colorado/Canyon also Tacoma.
The Ridgeline has the 60/40 split fold-up rear seat that offers pretty much a flat floor for storage. With seats down in seating position you have great amount of storage space underneath them.
This is like if carring a golf bag or duffel type luggage.
This was a feature on 1st genration Ridgeline but 2nd generation seats fold up higher so more space. Rear seating is more comfortable then other midsized trucks.

GM sells a half million mid-size trucks in 5 years. Only a whack-job like Oxi would call the GM midsize twins an "epic failure."

So, what happens? Oxi and Ridgeline2007 have a little circle-j*rk drooling about their favorite has-been products.

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Look at that grille!! Chevy innovation baby!! Woot woot!!

For most people who buy a midsize truck the current engine choices in the Colorado/Canyon are enough since most will not be towing with them. It is good that both offer the diesel for those who want more. If the new I-4 in the Silverado turns out to be a good engine then GM should offer it in both the Colorado/Canyon. Not a good comparison to compare the US market to the Australian. The EPA regulations whether you agree with them or not encourage larger trucks and smaller engine displacements.

For many diesels are seen as dirty and for those who want them the price difference between a gas engine and a diesel is great. Add the diesel gate to the mix and diesels have gotten a bad reputation whether you agree or not. For now the larger full size crew cab trucks are a top seller and have replaced the full size rear wheel drive family sedan. The few remaining rear wheel drive sedans such as the Charger and 300 are not selling in large numbers and the 300 will be discontinued in a few years replaced by a new all electric minivan. In the US Ford is discontinuing most of their cars and FCA has cut a number of cars and will continue to cut more cars.

If the market for midsize pickups continue to grow then you will see more offerings. I doubt Ford will just sit by and not offer special editions of the Ranger. Ford for now just wants to release the new Ranger and see what happens. Eventually Ford will offer more editions of the Ranger.

The Chicken Tax is just one of the barriers to offering more choice you also need to look at the EPA and CAFE regulations encouraging the larger size of trucks and gaming the CAFE standards with smaller displacement engines.

@Jeff

Good points.

Re the so-called Chicken Tax

Ironic how the people who yell the loudest about this tax are living in many countries that have blocked access to American industrial goods for decades. America's neighbor to the north has placed shocking taxes on our dairy products for decades.

Try entering Canada if you own a Concealed Weapons Permit in your state. Their border folks check your driver's license and their compute instantly informs them that you may be armed--whether or not you are.

They'll broom every grain of corn or wheat from the back of your truck at the same moment that Canadian grain trucks are roaring by on the opposite side of the road headed for US markets. Our current president has spoken very clearly on this topic. People are starting to notice.

We will deal with the countries that want to deal with us. We've been paying the bills for our so called allies long enough.

Thanks for mentioning it.

Say no...

UN Compact for Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration.

Yes, I’m a self proclaimed bigot. But mostly towards Ford.

UN Compact for Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration.
Posted by: the fake papajim | Nov 11, 2018

@the fake papajim

do you mean United Nations? Please explain. While you're at it why not use your real ID

STOP USING MY USERNAME

While you're at it why not use your real ID

Posted by: papajim | Nov 11, 2018 11:49:59 AM

Your real ID? As if your real ID says papajim on it.

You idiot

Just came back from the buddy's yearly dirt biking up in Lake Tahoe, CA. Of the 5-6 vehicles there, 3-4 were Chevy 1500 (GM1500). A couple of long van's, and one Toyota Landcruiser. The Landcruiser guy uses a full sized motorcycle hitch carrier (ie the motorcycle is on a rail parallel to the rear of the vehicle). Most every vehicle had two full size motorcycles of 400cc or larger.

The point is no midsizers whatsoever, and no discussion of them either, because midsizers don't do it for that application. Towing 5000lb is not the issue for these guys. Albeit one guy promoted trailer campers which the smaller ones can vary between 1200-3700lbs. The Ranger photo's show kids bikes 230cc and smaller. Midsizer's can't fit two large motorcycles with added gear with their 6'0" beds (measured from the top with tailgate up). A '84 Mazda B2000 with 6'2" bed (measured from the top with tailgate up), could fit a full size motorcycle and 2 other kids bikes in that bed.

As someone above said, the big three are more than motivated to sell you up to a full size.

It's a 232mile trip from Silicon Valley (Tesla plant) up to the greater Tahoe area, and the peak pass is 7200'. This is the first time I've seen a multitude of Tesla 3's driving along the lake too. So that implies an electric truck needs to have much higher than 232mile standard range because the battery's deplete much more rapidly with extended uphill to 7200' carrying a load of 400cc motorcycles. I'm thinking that a minimal 350mile standard range needs to be specified to suit a large metropolitan market (San Jose, CA) of people who love their weekend trips to Lake Tahoe for summertime camping, or winter time skiing.

We've been doing this trip for years now, and most of us have entered into our 50's. We work at staying active, but we have slowed a little.

Clearly, Tesla or Bollinger or Workhorse need to come out with a midsize truck, with the space of a full-size, to shake up the big 3 as has just happened with Tesla eating BMW's lunch.

Please read article titled Best Pickup Truck For Every Type Of Driver
Says Ridgeline is best for highway type of driver. This is what I have been saying all a long. I also say it's got a nice Torque Vectoring AWD
to aid you in All Weather situations. Nearly identical to Acura Super Handling AWD. The Pilot & Ridgeline are programed slightly different from MDX and RDX TLX. Ridgeline Pilot setup for more off road needs.
Also mentions Colorado and others.

@James: Considering the commentary here on PUTC before the C-twins were released, I'd say averaging over 100,000 units per year has been pretty good for GM. Certain individuals suggested they wouldn't sell more than a few hundred to a few thousand at most.

That said, I am a current owner of a 2019 Colorado with the V6 and I'm quite pleased with it. I did some light towing with it (enclosed cargo trailer) this last weekend over the highway and still realized nearly 25mpg over 150 miles with the truck hardly noticing the added drag. Of course, the trailer was heavier than its load so that isn't saying a whole lot but it's a darned sight better than what my 4-cylinder '97 Ranger would have done.

Now, I understand each person has their own ideas as to what's good and what's not. I disagree with your feelings on the V6 but then I would probably have gone for the I-4 were it not for future plans to tow an RV behind it that weighs more than a mere 2000#. And as far as I'm concerned, those 300 horses is the most power I've ever owned, with nearly all my previous vehicles over 40 years worth of driving ran 205 horses or less.

"He used to spar on this comments page with a guy he called DIM. FIVE BLEEPING YEARS AGO.
Which is just like yesterday to a fellow so fixated on making everyone else agree with him." ---- Posted by: papajim

Denver Mike, the one he calls 'DIM' is still very vocal today, albeit on a different board. That specific individual is till insulting and opinionated and still lacks the ability to support his arguments with documented facts; every reference he uses tends to contradict his argument.

Still, at least he tries. Unlike some here on PUTC, he doesn't noticeably use fake names or try to steal names on that board. Nor does he spout such drivel as has become common on the PUTC forums in place of legitimate discussion. I wonder now if he didn't give up on the group here because he just wouldn't stoop down to the general level of discussion found here any more?

"What does GM have to worry, they will get another illegal bailout and ignore our laws to get away with these failures!
Tacoma wins again!" ---- Posted by: oxi

Tacoma lost, at least where I'm concerned. Oh, the specs are all there, but neither the economy nor the driver's legroom were. I went Colorado.

"Ironic how the people who yell the loudest about this tax are living in many countries that have blocked access to American industrial goods for decades. America's neighbor to the north has placed shocking taxes on our dairy products for decades." ---- Posted by: papajim

Strange thing about that, PJ; I'm one of those complaining about the Chicken Tax, and I'm a born and bred American who's probably lived in more parts of this country than you. I saw what the Chicken Tax did to the small-truck industry and I'm still griping, 35 years after owning my first, truly compact, pickup.

The all new million mile tested C H E V R O L E T grille will be a game changer!! Man I can't wait for the test!!

Future PUTC mid size truck challenge:

"Colorado gets 25 extra empirical points for revised grille and wins!!"

GMSRGREAT: "YEAH!! FINALLY ANOTHER UNBIASED TEST!!!"